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Posted by negke [82.82.188.5] on 2008/03/19 20:37:16
An oldschoolish platform puzzle mod with 20 maps by CocoT. Inspired by the game "Stroke". Screenshots and download: http://cocot.planetquake.gamespy.c...

Good News!
#1 posted by dooomer [60.190.66.250] on 2008/03/20 01:43:56
Good to see this mod finished and released!
Hmm..
#2 posted by metlslime [98.210.181.179] on 2008/03/20 10:23:17
just played a few levels. First, i'm curious why it only runs in darkplaces? Are there some quakec extensions it needs or something? All of the content seem pretty standard and engine-agnostic.
Second, this sort of "step on certain tiles only once, others exactly twice, etc." game usually benefits from being able to see the entire layout. Most such games feature top-down views. The first person view makes it difficult to plan ahead, and instead you sort of run around and try stuff to see what works. I realize it is a quake mod, and first person view is pretty much a given, how about this for a solution -- give the player some special jump pad tiles (or maybe all green tiles could be jump pads) and when you jump from that tile, you shoot way up so you can survey the entire scene. You'd restrict horizontal movement during the jump so that players can't use it move anywhere.
Third, there's a real need for the visual design to actually communicate the game. Color codes are arbitrary and communicate little -- i had to read the instructions to figure it out. The floaty bits you're collecting/touching are similarly arbitrary, except for the hourglass which is somewhat representative. The starlights could be replaced with something that you instinctively want to collect all of, like coins, or something you instinctively want to touch all of, like unlit torches (that light up when you touch them.) Tiles could be textured with useful icons, numbers, or something. How about having skulls on the red tiles, "1" on yellow, and "2" on white, "EXIT" on the blue, etc?
And, not only should the game-critical objects be given more visual attention, the floaty metal lamp things should be MUCH simplified -- why is most of the polygon and texel density devoted to objects that are completely gameplay-neutral? I understand they are there to prevent diagonal movement, but they could be replaced with simple boxes or pyramid shapes or something, so they don't distract the interactive, useful elements.
Sorry to be negative, but these issues seemed pretty major (except the darkplaces thing, which i can assume was for a reason.)
Oops,
#3 posted by metlslime [98.210.181.179] on 2008/03/20 10:23:58
just realized this wasn't actually posted by the original author. Well, CocoT, hope you see this.
Chasecam Mode Might Help A Little
#4 posted by negke [82.83.33.231] on 2008/03/20 11:47:23
Original release thread here btw: http://forums.inside3d.com/viewtop...
Metlsime
#5 posted by Kell [80.192.19.108] on 2008/03/20 13:55:25
That's pretty much what I've been thinking since I saw the first screenshots on inside3D.
The actual premise of the game makes no sense for an FPS, because as you say - you can't think through the layout before committing. Which, if you think about it, is basically all you do with this kind of puzzle mechanic.
I'd also add that as well as mis-apportioned poly and texel density, the maps are simply choked with visual noise. Yeah, gigantic floating neon fortress thingies may look cool, but as a background they are really distracting.
I also googled up a page for the original game 'Stroke' with a few screenshots as well:
http://www.acid-play.com/download/...
Even this short review observes that games of this type lack longevity.
I can see what CocoT was trying to do: grab a simple puzzle mechanic from somewhere and remake it as a cool looking FPS. In other words, do what Portal did. But I don't find it particularly appealing. Sorry :(
#6 posted by gone [78.37.169.31] on 2008/03/20 16:35:12
good points metslime
#7 posted by Sielwolf [91.4.186.18] on 2008/03/20 17:57:09
runs on an engine that is quite "unsmooth" for me - check
only d/l is available at FP which I can´t be arsed to log in to - check
and...it´s posted by neg|ke, who also tried to blind us recently with his "QW anyone?" speedmap - I smell conspiracy!!
#8 posted by CocoT [98.212.126.174] on 2008/03/20 18:23:28
Thanks for the feedback, guys. Not exactly the kind I was hoping for, but I understand (and therefore respect) your point-of-view. I’ll comment briefly…
When I started working on this, I really had the concept of “mini-mod” in mind. In other words, this wasn’t supposed to turn into anything particularly fancy. I do admit I spent more time on this than originally planned and, today, I do consider it more like a mod than a mini-mod, but I am still rather humble about it.
That said, I’d still want to point out to a couple of reasons why the mod ended up looking the way it does (beside the fact that, once again, this was never initially intended to become a full-blown, professional-looking mod). I do agree that not reading the (short) help file would make it hard to understand what is going on at first. I obviously expected people to do that (I can’t imagine what people would think if they played UQC without doing that… but I’m digressing). Now, I do also agree that, in terms of visuals, there might have been ways to use colors and/or symbols to convey “messages” more adequately. I admit I hadn’t thought too much about it (even though “red” does equate “danger” and “green” means “walk on this as much as you want”, but it’s true I could have worked on the other colors). That is something that could be worked on for a future version (remember, this is only the first release!). Adding numbers or exit signs would also be easy to do. I do like my “starlights”, though, which, as the name indicates, do light up (like torches) when you touch them.
When it comes to saturated colors or goofy models, well, I’m going to have to point out the fact that being neither a mapper, modeler or skinner, this is the best/easiest I could come up with. As many modders from the Inside3D community would probably attest, we’ve realized that the only way to have anything done today as a modder is to do it all (read: not just the coding part) yourself. Personally, the way the maps look and the arbitrariness of elements design don’t bother me, but I can understand how people who are used to work with more refined and thought-out design might object.
I struggled with the idea of allowing top-down view or not. This, as you can guess, would be really easy to implement. The reason why I opted out was that I wanted SpaceWalk to offer a slightly different challenge than the original Stroke. If SpaceWalk was played with top-down view, I might as well have not bothered with it and given a download link to the original freeware. The mod is, I admit, already way too close to the original game as it is. It is true that it makes everything harder and it forces player to play each map several times to figure out the lay-out. A couple of friends of mine tested it and didn’t think it was an issue, as it simply forces you to look at the map a little differently, to “think through the layout” after you’ve committed rather than before, and therefore have to deal with trials and errors a little more often than is usually the case with this kind of game. But, maybe they were just being nice… ;-)
Now, I think I’d also like to add that, as was the case of my other mods (and in particular UQC), Spacewalk is a bit of a “base” and that the map-making is an element that could turn it into something even more fun. When I created UQC, I envisioned that only maps especially designed for it would show its full potential. Not being a mapper, I unfortunately had to be content with fitting the UQC elements into pre-existing maps. In the same way, I still believe that Spacewalk has potential and that people with more knowledge in mapping than I do could combine platforms and “solid” elements to create something even more fun. Whether some people will be interested in doing that or, as in the case of UQC, the mod will never have custom maps made for it, remains to be seen. In all cases, I’d like to point out that Spacewalk does offer elements that Stroke did not offer, such as moving platforms (see map sw20 for a good example of this) and tri-dimensionability (see map sw19 for a map that uses that), the latter, I think, could create interesting puzzles.
Anyway… that’s the end of my ramble, I suppose :-)
I hope I didn’t sound too defensive. I really wanted to give the creation of Spacewalk some context. It does not, obviously, excuse some of the possible flaws you’ve pointed out, but might explain them somewhat. I’ll make sure to think about your feedback (particularly in terms of gameplay-related visuals) into account for the next version.
#9 posted by CocoT [98.212.126.174] on 2008/03/20 18:26:10
Oh and... about Darkplaces. The reason why it is the recommended engine is because of physics issues. Most engine won't allow you to step on another models (the platforms being ones) without sliding on top (and eventually off) them.
It runs smoothly enough for me... and when it comes to FilePlanet, well, I'd be glad to upload it somewhere else if you point to me way a place I can do so :)
Coco
#10 posted by Mr Fribbles [121.44.230.49] on 2008/03/20 18:34:12
If that's the only reason to use Darkplaces, why not just make the platforms brush models? If it were just a common-or-garden variety func_plat or door then I guess it'd all be fine.
Then again I haven't played the mod, so I'm not sure if you're doing something funky with the platforms that would necessitate using an actual model.
Upload It To Mediafire.com
#11 posted by RickyT23 [86.137.233.151] on 2008/03/20 18:42:54
I use it - so far it's pure dynamite!
It also has a button to copy the url to your clipboard, either as a <href> or not, so its pretty easy to use.
People dont need to an account with Mediafire.com to download stuff either, and it has a built in image viewer...
#12 posted by CocoT [98.212.126.174] on 2008/03/20 19:01:31
Mr Fribbles: I don't really have the knowledge to know for sure how it would work, to tell you the truth. I guess the thing I want to be sure about is the fact I can play with skins, transparency and solidity.
RickyT23 : Muchos gracias for the tip! I've just uploaded it :)
Here is the new link: http://www.mediafire.com/?fj9c1u9s...
(contains the "hotfix", by the way)
Btw
#13 posted by Spirit [127.255.255.255] on 2008/03/20 19:42:57
There is the http://shub-hub.com especially for Quake files. ;)
password is ilovetheshubhub
#14 posted by CocoT [98.212.126.174] on 2008/03/20 20:14:51
Thanks, Spirit! :)
I had tried earlier, in fact, but without logging in and it wouldn't upload. Now it works fine!
Here is the new link: http://shub-hub.com/files/mods_sin...
Darkplaces
#15 posted by Preach [127.255.255.255] on 2008/03/20 20:16:09
Most engine won't allow you to step on another models (the platforms being ones) without sliding on top (and eventually off) them.
This is actually pretty easy to fix. Give the thing you're supposed to be stepping on a touch function that restores the FL_ONGROUND flag each frame and you're good to go. I assume that these platforms must have some kind of touch function already that you can incorporate this into...
#16 posted by CocoT [98.212.126.174] on 2008/03/21 05:44:12
I've looked into that and will look further in the future, but I'm afraid it's going to be a little complicated. In most engines I tried, the other problem was one of touching the platform several times as soon as it was touched (and therefore die as soon as the level starts). I don't really know what it is about Darkplaces that makes the whole thing work. I'll try to investigate...
By the way, when it comes to top-down view, I just wanted to point out (I had completely forgotten about this) that you can actually access some form of camera view by using "impulse 115". You can see what it looks like on the following thread: http://forums.inside3d.com/viewtop...
As I explain in that same thread, I'm not really a big fan and it will prove rather bad when it comes to 3D lay-outs, but I'll work on polishing it (credits for the original cam code goes to ShockMan, by the way) for the next release since people seem to really want it.

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