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Posted by Baseman Biff [24.158.204.102] on 2004/02/17 05:36:43
Just got through playing it. Loved it. Is the game gonna have an editor? Who all is gonna buy it? Why/why not? What makes the ocean salty? Who is the George Washington Bridge named after? Etc.

Info
#1 posted by Mapist [195.208.123.213] on 2004/02/17 05:45:56
"The PAIN Engine works a bit differently from most game engines. All the level design is done directly in a professional grade 3D modelling app, in this case, Maya. The Engine then imports the level directly into the game... but it isn't very mod friendly.
We will likely be releasing a world editor, but not a level editor. The world editor will allow you to repopulate the levels, setting your own spawn points etc., but will not allow for level design."
Bleh
#2 posted by Vondur [195.128.65.237] on 2004/02/17 05:47:12
i liked the game very much! i forgot when i laughed that loud last time when playing games :) it's funny toying with fyzics engine.
and i'm looking forward playing the full version of course.
...
#3 posted by Shambler [82.38.192.33] on 2004/02/17 07:30:21
Head bob is annoying and pointless.
Moving around could feel a lot smoother.
You can't bind a key to "," which is extremely fucking annoying for my control setup.
Changing weapons with mouse 3 is very b0rky.
I expect the lack of save/load will be very frustrating.
Fun Stuff
#4 posted by pjw [209.113.159.61] on 2004/02/17 09:45:30
I played this until 3:00 in the morning or so, and I'm pretty stoked.
Fun weapons, cool enemies, the levels just ooze atmosphere, and oddly, I'm very impressed with the music and sound effects, which is something that usually doesn't make all that much of an impression on me one way or the other.
There's a nice level of depth/replay embedded in this game (e.g. do X to unlock a card, find secrets, find secret items, etc.)
Has anyone figured out what "objects" you're supposed to destroy? I just get 0 every time . . . or is that broken/disabled for the demo?
Is anyone but me a sick bastard who laughed like a little girl after noticing that you can jump on the dead bodies and make them squirt innards? :)
And yes, the lack of a level editor makes me quite sad . . .
(Shambler, I'm pretty sure that the lack of save/load is just for the demo . . .)
#5 posted by pushplay [24.109.0.211] on 2004/02/17 16:52:20
Shambler: look at mouse wheel sensitivity in controls and set it to 3 or something like that. I don't know why they would do it like that.
As for the lack of level editor: I think that's really horrible. I would hope someone would hack the exe so we can design levels in Maya, populate them with the world editor, and play that. I can't believe a company that can make such a great game would lack the foresight of designing it to allow custom levels. It's boneheaded.
Bleh!
#6 posted by Vondur [217.70.16.165] on 2004/02/17 17:40:31
finished the demo!
it fucking rocks!
ROCKS!
/me hugs Painkiller and cannot wait for the full version!!!!1
Hmmmm...
#7 posted by Shambler [82.38.192.33] on 2004/02/17 18:13:40
Played, well, *some* of the first level. Until just after the wizard boss, and then someone was throwing zombies at me and I died. The lack of saving in the demo really, really sucks. If you're trying to sell your product via a demo, FFS don't make it offputtingly frustrating playing the damn thing.
Anyway, aside from that and the stupid control b0rkage (mouse wheel is now working, mouse 3 isn't), quite entertaining game. Basically does what it says on the tin. Not too horde combat based so far, thankfully. Collecting souls is fun as is the all-too-brief bezerker mode. The main gameplay issue I found was a lack of health even with the souls. Needs more trick moves too... Good physics engine though. So, ummm yeah, someone h4x0r fucking saving in already.
I Am Torn...
#8 posted by biff_debris [24.158.204.102] on 2004/02/17 18:52:07
On one hand, I really wanna play the game -- but on the other I am pissed all to hell that it doesnt have a built-in map editor. I would really love to show it to these people Can Fly bastids, and boycott their game for such an oversight, but it's so much fun.
Damn them. Damn them to hell. I'll prolly end up getting it.
My Impressions...
#9 posted by Scragbait [65.92.13.142] on 2004/02/17 20:04:09
...unfortunately based on partial completion of the first map. I agree with Shambler completely wrt saving. I made a stupid mistake and blew a barrel up in my face so it's back to square 1. You want to make people as happy as possible to sell your product and providing a save option is good business sense. Please don't annoy prospective buyers. I don't have an MBA education to back up this statement but I have bought things before.
Pant, pant. Anyhow, this game looks and plays great (plays as well as could be expected on my now lesser machine). I like the theme and the physics engine is very entertaining. I watched the trailer and compared to that, playing on my 1.2GHz P4 + 64MB Radeon was like being in a nightmare where time itself sloooowed way down and it's like trying to run in corn syrup. Not such a bad thing since it allowed me to actually aim whereas keeping time constant would have made it unplayable. Grabbing floating souls before they disappeared was fun and very much needed since health was sparse. Breaking coffins for gold was interesting but I don't know what the treasure will be used for (perhaps something cool in the full game.)
I toggled the music off and that improved the ambiance. I took the suggestion listed above and got the mouse wheel to work nicely.
I know this is only a demo and this comment could be premature but despite the great setting and enemies and obvious gothic horror theme, it doesn't seem scary at all compared to other games that did elicit fear (Undying, AvP2, System Shock 2). I hope the final version does attempt to build fear using techniques of suspense as used on these other games; drawing you in and freaking you out. If, instead, it adopts a more arcade style mob-mowing gameplay architecture (and they kind of advertise this on their website), that would be a disappointment and a waste of what looks to be very high quality ingredients. Wouldn't it be nice if they had a skill setting that did feature mob slaughter for fun after you finished the proper, well thought out and carefully crafted story based SP campaign.
Based on what I've seen so far, this game is on my wish list but I'll probably wait for the price to drop. It looks and feels very cool. Wish me luck in having the patience to finish all the demo as I really do want to see everything in it.
Got Further
#10 posted by Scragbait [65.92.9.184] on 2004/02/17 22:43:29
This game is a definate winner. Very cool settings and the new physics engine is a real treat. I just finished the first map and I know that I want to go back and find those secrets and goodies. Difficulty feels right for the Insomnia skill level. Despite the Matrix-like slow pace, it is still fun and playable on my system. On a killer box, it would be awesome.
The one thing (amongst other things) that I love is how this game really offers the rewarding one-shot kills for the player who takes the effort to make shots count. Headshots followed by aerial cartwheels is too cool for words alone. Wheras some games force you to hose down enemies with copious quantities of lead, in Painkiller, you can lay them down with a well placed dowel rod. The speargun is my favorite.
One unforgivable flaw (which would be more forgivable if saves were allowed) is that on the second map, second arena with one bad guy left (an archer up high), I got permanently stuck between two angled pillars leaning up against the central building. I had to bail out of the game since I don't know the cheats. That made me grumpy but so far, this game is a must have for both looks and fun.
It's not scary though...
#11 posted by pushplay [24.109.0.211] on 2004/02/17 23:39:16
Scary games are a dime a dozen and usually poorly done. I'd prefer to have something original.
I discovered that the alt fire on weapon 1 is actually rather powerful. It pulls dead bodies towards you making it easier to collect souls. I also found an instance of z-fighting in the first map and posted about it on the pk message board because I'm just that anal.
ROCKAGE!
#12 posted by DaZ [212.159.60.58] on 2004/02/18 05:19:34
I love this game =)
How fucking gorgeous is the palace map???! The end area make me peej all over the screen, love all the bags of fireworks you can set off as well, cool touch and it shoows off the games graphics and physics too :)
Scragbait - With money you buy "tarot card" powerups (2 available in demo) that give you stuff like more starting health, bullet time, 2x damage etc...
Sucks about the editing thing, hopefully there will be a 3dsmax import/export plugin so I can get jiggy!
Bleh!
#13 posted by Vondur [195.128.65.237] on 2004/02/18 05:31:47
petard sacks rocks!
it was nearly orgasmic feel to see/hear them blasting! :)
My 2 Cents
#14 posted by Megazoid [194.168.3.18] on 2004/02/18 07:38:49
First: Thanks pushplay, that mouse wheel problem was bugging me. :)
Too much Serious Sam style horde combat in some levels. All the levels look gorgeous in texture, detail & architecture, but very simplistic in layout - just sort of open arenas.
Apart from these beefs, I would say the game rocks. Really enjoying the demo so far. :)
Performance
#15 posted by Megazoid [194.168.3.18] on 2004/02/18 07:48:45
The default video settings on the demo are all maxed. If you reduce the resolution to say 800x600, set the textures to medium and turn off dynamic lighting the demo plays fine on a 1 ghz chip (I have a geforce 4).
Heh
#16 posted by R.P.G. [24.136.229.24] on 2004/02/18 08:21:41
the demo plays fine on a 1 ghz chip (I have a geforce 4).
I was about to start downloading until I saw the "geforce 4" bit.
Heh...
#17 posted by FaTbOy! [66.245.78.140] on 2004/02/18 09:45:19
I was looking at this game last night contemplateing a download. For some reason I was thinking it was a quake mod... then I saw system specs... not on my K6-2 500 with Voodoo3 action!
Still its a cool looking game, and I will likely check it out once I get my new machine. Being a computer tech does have its perks! ;) cheap partz! woohoo!
Blah
#18 posted by pjw [209.113.159.61] on 2004/02/18 10:05:27
With money you buy "tarot card" powerups (2 available in demo)
Two, that is, until you unlock more . . .
I saw a fair number of technical problems in the game as well--couple of places where you could see through the ground to grayness, couple of very sticky points like Scragbait encountered, and a truly spectacular array of t-junction errors at one point in the palace level.
I just heard that the weapons have a tertiary fire as well (primary + alt), so I'll need to investigate that, and possibly remap controls a bit . . .
Poor, Sad
#19 posted by pjw [209.113.159.61] on 2004/02/18 10:06:28
fucking lonely quote tag.
Lower Specs
#20 posted by Megazoid [194.168.3.18] on 2004/02/18 11:05:16
R.P.G. : You can reduce the setting even further, maybe getting to run on lower machine specs. Texture can go down to very low, and lower secreen resolutions. I was just saying, it runs "okay" at about medium resolution on my machine.
Minimum Requirements:
OS: Windows 98\ME\2000\XP
CPU: 1 GHz Intel Pentium III or AMD Athlon processor
RAM: 256 MB
CD-ROM or DVD-ROM speed: 4x
Hard Drive space: 1.2 GB available
Video: 32 MB Direct 3D compatible video card
Sound: DirectX 8.1b or better compatible sound card
Other Information
#21 posted by Megazoid [194.168.3.18] on 2004/02/18 11:26:47
http://painkiller.p0wned.org has some useful info on PainKiller. In the "How To's" section they have have some config settings, FAQ & stuff.
There's also #painkiller.euro and #painkillergame both on irc.quakenet.org.
Thoughts
#22 posted by R.P.G. [24.136.229.24] on 2004/02/18 12:09:57
I don't know where you got that minimum requirements list from, Megazoid, but the one on the official site and in the readme is quite different (1.5ghz CPU, 384mb of RAM, 64mb video card).
Anyway, I decided to download and try it anyway. I dropped almost everything down to the lowest possible setting, and performance is very slow (1.1ghz, 512mb of RAM, 32mb GF2). Most of the time it feels like I'm stuck in Bullet Bime (TM (c) 1999 Wachowski brothers, all rights reserved). The environments are pretty cool and massive, but the gameplay style seems way too repetitive. As someone else said, it's Serious Sam revisited. I don't think I'd really like a whole game like this, unless it was priced lower than competing games (a la Serious Sam). The physics are a cool, but mostly they don't affect gameplay much.
Meh. I'll wait until I have a faster computer, and by then I can probably get the game for $20 to $30.
Megazoid
#23 posted by Vondur [217.70.16.165] on 2004/02/18 12:25:40
thanks for the url!
very useful info there!
Btw Shamb
#24 posted by Vondur [217.70.16.165] on 2004/02/18 12:51:18
you can disable headbob by editing \Bin\config.ini file. find there this line:
Cfg.HeadBob = 100
and change 100 to 0 :)
you can also set
Cfg.AllowBunnyhopping = true
;)
Cheers Von & Mega...
#25 posted by Shambler [82.38.192.33] on 2004/02/18 17:56:45
...but is there a Cfg.allowrebinding","key = true setting?? :P
Hmmm
#26 posted by Mr Fribbles [202.161.117.131] on 2004/02/18 20:28:06
Well I haven't played the demo, but a while ago there was a 'painkiller first look build' that was floating around here at the office.
I played 2 levels - some graveyard/crypt thing, and some kind of burning/decaying city?
The cheats were permanently on in the build I had, so I can't comment on the difficulty, but the game ran pitifully slow on my work computer (geforce3 and 1ghz cpu), slow to the point where I couldn't look in some directions on the 2nd map because it went to like 1 fps (this is why I stopped playing in the end!)
The levels looked nice, but as someone mentioned above the gameplay/layouts of the maps was very repetetive. Personally I find the environments and general theme of the game toooo over the top cliche horror/scary etc.
Not very impressed by the build I had, maybe the demo is better.. :D
Played.
#27 posted by necros [63.139.106.197] on 2004/02/21 15:06:17
it's very nice that they gave more than one or two levels to play.
i like all the details and such... the first map was really cool with all the junk littering the ground etc... i really like the stake gun. that gun rocks in so many ways! the stakes even fall after a while in the air instead of going straight forever! awesome! it's fun shooting someone in the head, and seeing this big massive piece of wood jutting out of his eye! >:)
i'm looking forward to the full game when i'll be able to SAVE. shit, that was the most annoying thing in the whole game.
it's a little linear too... just felt like going from battle to battle... and didn't really have a sense of flow.
#28 posted by pushplay [24.109.0.211] on 2004/02/23 21:22:39
For anyone who doesn't read BluesNews and wants to find the secrets:
http://members.shaw.ca/dircen/
That Really Is Very Sad News ...
#29 posted by sock [82.133.96.38] on 2004/03/02 09:15:57
"We will likely be releasing a world editor, but not a level editor. The world editor will allow you to repopulate the levels, setting your own spawn points etc., but will not allow for level design."
That is really sad news. I was totally wound up ready to play the game to death and make some maps for it. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot.
Sock
Sock:
#30 posted by Scampie [216.220.241.97] on 2004/03/02 10:13:58
The reasons for it was becuase they made all the maps in Maya and populated them with the world editor(at least, that's what I've heard). I hope they at least leave the ability to create new levels with that, or other high end 3d packages... they only said they weren't releasing a specific level editor.
This Is Similar
#31 posted by spentron [171.75.33.148] on 2004/03/02 10:36:58
Some people already make UT, etc. levels by importing the geometry. Texturing and items must still be done in the level editor.
It didn't say if importation is part of the world editor to be released, but it's certainly part of the system they use.
Scampie
#32 posted by sock [82.133.96.38] on 2004/03/02 10:40:42
It would not take too much effort to allow the import of new maps from Maya. But I got the impression you are just going to be able to add some new monsters, re-arrange some debris and add new treasure. Maybe the Maya sections are like lego or something and you can re-arrange them into new patterns.
But to be totally honest, with a game like this feeling so nice and visual and apparently having CPMA testers for the MP section of the game it does not matter too much about the editing tools.
Sock
How Many People...
#33 posted by Scragbait [209.226.65.58] on 2004/03/04 12:44:28
... who downloaded this demo finished it? Without the ability to save, I just got going in the third arena in level 2 before dying and calling it a day.
Is the third map nice? Don't know if I'm motivated to try again.
3rd Level
#34 posted by DaZ [212.159.60.58] on 2004/03/04 12:46:35
is just a boss fight, but its quite cool watching him destroy everything :) I see no problems in playing level 2 again, it rocks! :D
All The Way Through ...well, Sort Of.
#35 posted by R.P.G. [24.136.230.101] on 2004/03/04 12:51:57
Painkiller doesn't particularly like chugging along on this computer, and it crashed about halfway through the first map. I completed the other two maps without much difficulty; though I think I turned the skill setting down so there would be fewer monsters and consequently the game would run faster.
Heh
#36 posted by necros [63.139.106.197] on 2004/03/04 13:37:57
i got the game to crash in the last fight on the second level. :P
I've Finished
#37 posted by Vondur [217.70.16.165] on 2004/03/04 14:45:36
it on EASY :)
Good Idea Von!
#38 posted by Shambler [82.38.192.217] on 2004/03/04 18:27:44
I'm now playing it on Easy too (which is indeed very easy, e.g. I started level 2 with 100 health and finished with, ummm, 360 or something), it compensates for the lack of save and allows me to appreciate what the style of the game is like.
Painkiller Hints
#39 posted by pushplay [24.109.0.211] on 2004/03/04 21:48:30
Use the alt fire on the default weapon (orange globe you shoot and recall) a lot. When you fix the globe to the floor and keep it in centre screen an orange beem runs from there to you which does a fair bit of damage. Also, baddies you kill with a direct hit fly towards you making it easy to pick up the soul. And for short distances it's the best damage/sec weapon, so that's what you need to take down the fat guys.
I really love that weapon, I was able to beat levels 1 and 2 on the hardest setting with only that weapon.
Title Can Be Empty
#40 posted by Shambler [82.38.194.13] on 2004/03/12 15:22:41
Good - good action, old-skool feel, reasonably controllable, nice atmosphere and architecture, good physics, soul collecting mechanism.
Bad - lack of saving, head bob sucks arse, can't use certain keys, horde reliant, damage feedback for player and enemy is poor, a bit cartoony, boss arena is as tedious as expected, progression is very artificial
Most prominent aspects - hmmmm, the new Quake, maybe....maybe not... I'm not particularly keen on horde based action as it's often boring, and found this a bit hordey, mostly in the second map. However it's generally good fun, weapons are good, monsters are entertaining etc etc. Although the Axemen take ages to die, with no damage indication. The basics for a good, if basic, FPS. The soul collecting is a very good gameplay mechanism, and the beserker mode is cool if too slow and short-lived. Pity about having to kill enemy to lower gates to progress, that spoils the otherwise good atmosphere. On the plus side the physics enhance that atmosphere for sure. There's also some interesting trick potential including mad bunny-hopping....could be the new speedrunning game =).
To buy or not to buy?? - Probably. As far as old skool action goes this is pretty satisfying, and I can see it being a good one to dip in and out of for a quick blast.

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