Darkplaces SoA Water Swell Problem

[Xeauron]

Hi again all, (FYI - I've searched at great length regarding this issue)
Looking for some help running dark places Scourge of Armagon mission pack. I've almost finished Quake and wanted to go on to play the mission packs, however I've spent the last 3 days finding and hand picking mods to add to the hipnotic folder.

But nothing I add bar one thing sorts the water problem in HIP1M2 and other maps where the water surface bobs up and down, which causes a horrible flickering and twitching of the water itself: (see also framerate!)

darkplaces sdl 2012 11 26 15 12 24 70 - YouTube

(It normally runs at a solid 60fps @ 1080 apart from areas with 'swelling' water - youtube is only 30fps and for some reason the video went dark once uploaded)

I've downloaded the epsilon pack, which I didn't really care for as it includes a load of additions which poison the visuals and audio in my opinion (though I liked the music lol).

The progs.dat file from the small mod compelation included in that pack sorts the water problem out, however it adds footsteps (nope), muzzle smoke (yuck), some wierd effect around powerups and a million other minor additions which all add up. - none of which I like or want at all. I don't mind muzzle flash, but not muzzle smoke :-)

Is there any fix (progs.dat?) out there which will simply sort the water out for this expansion without messing with anything else??? Or can someone point me to a tutorial?

Thanks for your help in advance. It's driving me up the wall trying to get this sorted without effecting any other part of the game.

[Seven]

Hello,

First of all, dont use any mod or replacement content or additional .pk3�s or .pak�s, nor modified progs.dat�s.
How is the result then ?

Next,
You are using an interesting DP build...
What happens, when using another build ?
Did you try another engine (cause you said you do not care about replacement stuff) ?

Next,
You say you are using the epsilon pack. What happens if you do not use it ?

Next,
You say that you are using the "small mod compilation"�s progs.dat, that sorts this issue.
Why not turn off the features that you do not like ?

Anyway, play Quake without mods is always a good idea.
Mods ruin much and bring unwanted stuff with them.

Clean & pure Hipnotic has absolutely no water issue at all.
So you should play it that way... cause that seems to be the way you want it anyhow.

Good luck,
Seven

[Xeauron]

Hi Seven,
Thanks for the reply

Apologies, I should have mentioned I've tried removing everything.

When I disable everything - remove all PK3s from the directory I still get the bobbing water problem (flicker), except it's a solid texture and cannot see through it. So basically for me the water issue remains even when I run it 'clean', and it seems I'm not the only one: (he has the exact same problem and he states he's running dark places - not sure which build)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XuEgA-akaws&feature=g-hist]Let's play Quake Scourge of Armagon #2: Bouncing water - YouTube[/ame]

Mine looks pretty much identical to that when mods are removed.

I'm basically looking for the upgraded quake experience in so far as to include:

HD textures (QRP pack)
Dynamic shadows and light
3D models for health and ammo / powerups
Music without the need for CD in the drive
Pretty water
HD skins for weapons and enemies

And that's about it I think...

As stated above I do not use the epsilon pack as it wasn't 'tailored' for my tastes, I like certain upgrades but loathe others. I suppose I'm just trying to play Quake in HD with the environment and sound in tact. I downloaded the epsilon pack as it has the enemy skins I couldn't find, even then I had to remove the luma layer from them as someone had added a ridiculous looking layer to most enemies making them look really odd and breaking their relative lighting...

When I add the progs.dat file from the small mod compilation into my hipnotic folder the water on that level no longer bobs up and down, and is instead a flat surface the same as in original quake levels and works perfectly with no frame drops.

I just don't know how to stop the surface from bobbing on it's own. Or how to disable the other million tweaks added to the game with the use of that progs.dat file.

Worse still, when I use that progs file I have to include the progs folder which adds in a new dog model which looks ugly, more debris, and other models I don't care for otherwise I get missing model errors and rainbow diamonds appear in their place.

I presumed there would be something I needed to compile or omit or enter into the console to prevent the water swelling as seen in the video, though I've been reluctant to try another build as the one I have looks gorgeous and plays perfectly with quake original, it just won't play ball with this water in the expansion pack.

I'll have a look into using another build but I'm unsure as to where the official repository is for 64 bit darkplaces builds is...

Oh and thanks, I believe some of the stuff I'm using to enhance quake was made/edited by you...lol

[Seven]

I just tested pure Hipnotic and the water moves slowly up and down as it should.
So did you try another DP build yet (as I suggested above) ?
The build version is even visible in your clip. (open console and look).
Do not always use the latest autobuild !

Also try other engines with replacement support (if you want to use replacement content).
You will find a list on the homepage of this forum.

Read the readme.txt from the "small mod compilation", if this is the only way that stops that issue that you have.
And use the HIPNOTIC version, not the Quake version.
The water will still move slowly up and down with it.
Download is available in this forum.
Read the readme.txt to see how to disable your unwanted features:
- dog model
- debris
- muzzle smoke
- ...
You will not get any diamonds if you use the unaltered version from this forum.
You have to use the "small mod compilation"�s .pk3 file. NOT the progs.dat only.


But as stated above, better do not use any mods (especially the unsupported epsilon compilation) to play Quake as it was meant to be.

Handpick the stuff you want to have and get rid of the rest. This forum is full of that kind of things.


Again:
First try to get rid of that issue without any mods or replacement files first, then start to build your own compilation.
And be sure to read the included readme.txt files.
That will make your life easier.

Have fun,
Seven

PS: You will find a link to a recommended DP build in the readme.txt of the small mod compilation too.

[Xeauron]

Again, thanks.

I've tried build DarkPlaces engine Windows 64 OpenGL build 20110628 and the frame rate doesn't drop as much, however the water surface still flickers.

I was using the hipnotic version of the small mod compilation, and I narrowed the fix down to something in the progs.dat file stopping the water surface from moving. It just includes a load of other tweaks I can't seem to disable.

I would have thought more people would have had issues with the water flickering in SoA and that there would be a simple fix I overlooked...

I'll do some research into disabling the features of the small mod compilation, looks like that's my only choice then.

Thanks

EDIT: oh my god, now fans / doors and force fields have disappeared....I give up... lol

[Moon[Drunk]]

Could it have something to do with how you start hipnotic?
If I remember correctly I had the same issue once and I think I fixed it by not using -game hipnotic but instead only -hipnotic!
For example: darkplaces.exe -hipnotic

[Xeauron]

Hi Moon

I've just this minute found out what's actually wrong.

After rebuilding the game in a seperate directory peice by peice, turns out the problem was in the autoexec file.

Because I use a pad to play from the sofa, when straifing and turning at the same time the game had an inexplicable judder which I found I could eliminate by matching the game's ticrate with the screen refresh, so I added the line:

sys_ticrate 0.0166667

Once I remove that line from the autoexec from the hipnotic folder the water behaves itself.

However the frame rate suffers because of this moving water meaning I end up with somewhere between 24 - 54 frames per second depending on where I'm looking.

I could still do with a solution to flatten the water and stop it from moving up and down.

I was able to play through Quake (main game) @ 1080 with ultra settings without dropping a single frame the entire game, even during intense battles.

Now I find that because the water moves in this expansion it's crippling the game for no good reason...

I tried adding the small mod compelation, which flattens the water, but the locked doors (require a key), moving objects and forcefields are no longer present in the game meaning I could just stroll straight to the exit.

There are also annoying additions which seemingly cannot be disabled.

There is a patch somewhere in the progs.dat file which disables the movement of the water, that's all I need really! I can then re-enable the ticrate I want to play...

So close but yet so far.

I'm close to giving up and not bothering to play this expansion via darkplaces if I'm getting sh***y frame rates because of water suddenly. I really want to play it as well.

[Syluxguy28O3]

well, i think its better to switch to a different client or build if this is giving you this much trouble. sit back, relax, and quake it up!!

[Xeauron]

Yeah, since it's only level HIP1M2 that there seems to be a problem with so far I'm going to stick to darkplaces as HIP1M3 seems to be fine so do a couple of other levels I've tested.

It seems to be something in HIP1M2 which causes a catastrophic frame drop when near water...Not sure if there are any other maps which are likely to cause this problem in this expansion.

Everywhere else I get a solid 60fps on ultra settings except on that level where it can drop as low as 18fps. God knows why, the lighting and architecture don't look complex enough to stress my computer out at all. In fact I've seen more complex structures in standard quake maps and my comp didn't even break a sweat. I'm guessing it has something to do with the map itself not being optimized in some way, or reacting badly to the darkplaces engine?

[Seven]

Do not worry too much.
If you managed to pass the 1st episode, you will enter the really beautiful levels of mission pack 1: the 2 fantasy-set episodes.
You will have forgot hip1m2 by then...

And if you like Quake single player, you should play all the other highly recommended fan-made maps. Go and start your search at Spirits�s quaddicted.com page.

I would suggest some of them, but there are so many that you cannot afford to miss, so I will not mention any. Simply filter the map archive at Spirits page according ratings and begin.


Now we should end this discussion and you should continue to play

[Xeauron]

Haha, yeah I've already been through the expansions mate on my older computer with original quake engine and loved them. I first played quake 1 on my Pentium 166mhz computer shortly after it came out and it's the first game that made me say "Holy s**t! my computer is capable of this?" And that was on a crappy trident graphics card before 3dfx was popular. I suppose it's the game that really got me into PC gaming, I've been hooked ever since.

Now I've got a relatively beastly machine (core i7, GTX680) I'm loving playing through it with HD textures and upgraded engine.

I've already downloaded "Travail" pack, though the textures in that aren't HD so it looks pretty hideous by comparison. Any suggestions to get it looking better are welcome.

I've also downloaded "The Myths" and "Beyond Belief", not sure about the texturing in those ether as I haven't installed them properly yet.

I'll definitely be giving that website you suggested a look, so thanks for the tip.