Small Mod compilation

[Mr.Burns]

Hello Seven,
I had something in my mind....
Do you remember about one of our painskin dicussions?
What do you think about? There are many skins but I think we can do it Seven)

Quake should have painskins. I think this would be a good idea....:

Hi WA/Seven.
I would have to agree with you. If it helps, one could always use the Painkeep mod as a starting point/code base/inspiration. The players have painskins that seem to get progressively worse as the injuries increase.
Mod download URL : pk11full.zip - Download PainKeep (full)
Source: http://www.quakewiki.net/archives/te...p/pk111src.zip
Website: team evolve products
Server: connect newyork.servequake.com:26003

Alternatively you could also consider a suggestion from the R00k which was to place blood over the player model at the position at which the injury occurred (leg, shoulder, etc). Needless to say the mighty R00k or Seven could probably implement something like this in their sleep but I thought I wold mention it as it seemed to add yet more realism to the game.

Kind regards

Monty
[I finally made 1000+ posts , I really must get out more ]

[webangel]

Hi WA/Seven.
...
Alternatively you could also consider a suggestion from the R00k which was to place blood over the player model at the position at which the injury occurred (leg, shoulder, etc). Needless to say the mighty R00k or Seven could probably implement something like this in their sleep but I thought I wold mention it as it seemed to add yet more realism to the game.
...

Hi Mr.Burns,
this idea sounds very nice. Wonder what Seven says about it.

[talisa]

Alternatively you could also consider a suggestion from the R00k which was to place blood over the player model at the position at which the injury occurred (leg, shoulder, etc)

that is actually what the cl_decals_models cvar in darkplaces already does

it allows decals to end up on models, meaning monsters will have blood on them when shot and where it is hit.
sadly enabling this option can cause a huge performance-drop at moments. if it didnt i would totally have this cvar enabled by default

[webangel]

Hi Talissa,
sure I know this cvar...
But as far I can remember the position isnt right. And the bloodsplatters are disappearing.
I can be wrong about that

Dont tried it for some time because of the fps drops....

[Seven]

Hello,

Thank you very much for your feedbacks and support !

Do you remember about one of our painskin dicussions?
What do you think about? There are many skins but I think we can do it Seven)

Quake should have painskins. I think this would be a good idea.

with so meany skins to chose from pain skins sound like a lot of work but it would be a nice add it adds a lot i think when your tearing apart monsters with the nail gun

... use the Painkeep mod ...
The players have painskins that seem to get progressively worse as the injuries increase.

Hello,

Regarding the painskin topic, these are my thougths:

1.) The Quake monsters usualy have wounds and are blood-splattered in their initial appearance (their default/original skins) already.
Quake monsters as well as the Quake universe itself is a dirty / rough / brutal place.
Most people, using this small mod, also use rtlights which makes the world quite dark, spooky with lots of shadows.
These points will make painskins almost not visible, or very hard to see / notice in this fast paced game.
Maybe using special "death-skins" for the corpses would be more useful ?!

2.) Quake does not have a locational damage system. Many people tried to code a semi-locational damage system for Quake. But all attemps so far are not really convincing. I think Spike can confirm this, because he saw them all at inside3d.
So, shooting a monster into his side and seeing a painskin with wounds in the head or in the legs is not really what we are looking for.

3.) As webangel and Josh already said: The insane amount of available monster replacements (models as well as skins and a combination of both) makes it impossible to cover all.
The SMC is just a small mod. Not a full Quake game or compilation. And even for a full Quake compilation, the user will most probably exchange monster models / files.
Most people, using this small mod, also use replacement files (including monsters).
So, we never know which monsters the user is using and it is impossible to check it via qc.

As a summary of the above points, painskins (if any) is something for the individual user and his favorite replacements.
The implentation of painskins via QC is really simple though (if we can live with Quake�s primitive bbox location system), as it is a 2-liner in their pain function to check for their health-status and switch their .skin accordingly.

There are already mods, which cover a great number of Quake monster and bring painskins with them.
Example: The Reload mod:

the foot print look grate. what a mess it will make! maybe to make it interesting the wizered could bleed green or something...

Hello Josh,

I was interpretating your idea as "bleeding monsters", rather than "bloody footprints".
I know, the clip in my previous post did not properly show the blood drops coming out of the monsters wounded body, as the blood was too transparent and the clip�s quality too weak.
So, it might look as simple bloody footprints, that the monster creates / leaves
But in-game you will see the blood drops better (coming somewhere from the center area of the monsters body).
And because of the fact, that blood usualy simply drops to the ground beneath a person (rather than fly away in a high arch), it *might* look as footprints But when you see other monsters (or flying monsters) it will be more clear (hopefully).

And yes sir, the wizard might get green blood / decals !
(even though the regular red-ish spawnblood function will not match then anymore for him ...)

i like the new health pickup! a option to make them not spin would be nice to have. i like the pickup effect after you get the health. i did not have the sound on but maybe a drinking sound when you pick it up...

Aye sir. You will have the option to not make them spin.
I will also look for a fitting sound file.



===================================


But lets enjoy today Santa Claus Day !
(especially with our beloved younger ones...)

Warm wishes to all of you !!

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6pxe__dselQ]IMG 1301 - YouTube[/ame]

Sincerely,
Seven

[webangel]

Okay,
I understand your issues Seven. I see the same problems.
But isn�t it possible via qc to "blend" a damage texture to a hurt enemy?
I dont know how to call it.
Just edit some transparent parts into a texture and add a "wound" or a decal texture to it....

Keyword: "blendFunc GL_SRC_ALPHA"

Sorry if my question sounds stupid!

Have a nice Santa Claus Day with your kiddies.

[Seven]

Hello webangel,

Yes, you can add and glue additional models to an existing model and force it to follow the existing model exactly.
But there we face the initial problem again:
There are different replacement models for all monsters.
And their shape (inside the bbox) is differing.

I think, as a summary, if we would only have the original ID1 monsters (together with the original skin textures) a lot of neat things could be possible.
But a universal way for all the variations is in my opinion not possible.

As mentioned above, you can do this for your fixed monster pack you are using, though.

Viele Gr��e.

[JDSTONE]

that video was funny! its always nice to be able to fill out a comment card and have it considered... i wanna move to where your at seven i got 2 weeks still befor i get to play with the cool toys i got my kid for Santa day.

[Seven]

its always nice to be able to fill out a comment card and have it considered...

Hello Josh,

The opposite is the case.
Without creative people like you this mod would have died long time ago.
It is made to be used by people; so it lives from ideas, suggestions and feedback from people.

I for example love your idea of bleeding monsters !
It is really great and fits perfectly into this small mod. Why didnt we have it earlier ?

--------

I want to unleash the dragon now but have one small general question:
Is this something that should be in the "small mod compilation" ?
Or is it better to keep it out. I am not sure, so I would like to ask.

Kind regards,
Seven

[webangel]

Bleeding mosters idea is very good.
About the difficulty settings: "Why not".
Everything is still adjustable.

[talisa]

about monster-health and bullet-damage settings... why not, it could be nice for people who have to do more hits to kill monsters

i have an idea though for a feature which imo is kinda needed now with the new all the new randomly spawned monsters and the more difficult scrag+fiend:
-higher max ammo-count you can carry for all weapons (not super-neccesary, but would be nice)
-doubled ammo-pickups (duplicated ammo-boxes)

.

i love the afrit and the warlord and hydra and the more difficult options for scrag+fiend,
but cuz of them you end up being out of ammo waaay more often cuz they take a lot more hits then normal enemies,
and the amount of ammunition placed in maps wasnt placed with those in mind.

so perhaps a feature could be implented which will make that ammo-boxes will spawn with a duplicate right next to them, just like in dukeplus?
wouldnt it be possible to use the clone-monsters code to make an option to have all ammo-boxes spawn a duplicate next to them?

.

imo this is something that is kinda almost needed with the new monsters and the harder monsters,
cuz you way more often run out of ammo now cuz the amount of ammo placed in maps wasnt made with these new+harder monsters in mind

that, and it would also help greatly for when playing with the new health+damage options you'll be implenting

[gdiddy62]

Interesting idea about the ammo and health talisa!
I think your dragon idea and the code you linked to would be great ideas Seven. Something we briefly talked about long ago was the ability to use cvars to decide which monsters would show on which maps. I think it would be interesting to use a dragon model on the castle/medievil levels in place of the scrag and then the scrag/afrit on others. How hard would something like this be to code into SMC and would anyone else like that if it is possible?

[JDSTONE]

i think all the monster health is over kill its so easy to make that change in qc if some one wants to change it and dose not know qc it would be something to encourage them to learn it.

i have messed with the ammo setting in the smc to try to find a amo balance doubling the ammo pick up is too much i think but if monsters had more ammo drops like 5 or 10 nails in the back pack of an orge. and maybe something for the knights...


if your thinking of new monsters i would like to have wrath be a wizered replacement but i think he would need a different attack that is weaker or at least take the homming out of his vlore ball unless hes replacing a vlore .

a monster with a homming attack needs to be in the right place of the map cose if you dont have a place to hide and you got 3 or 6 of them your never not going to die...

[Seven]

Hello,

Thank you for your replies. I would like to comment them.

Regarding double-ammo-boxes:
The approach would be identical to the clone-monsters code, yes. But I am with Josh that this might change the gamebalance more than the monster replacements.

You mentioned the Warlord. He has the same health and quite similar abilities compared to the monsters he is able to replace: ogre and hellknight. So this fellow is quite equal.
Next is the Hydra which can replace the fish. Its health is slightly higher, but should not be considered noticeable.
The new abilities for the Wizard and Demon: Teleporting can indeed lead to a tougher fight and you maybe will shoot some ammo into thin air But that makes it more interesting and one must concentrate more fighting those.
The spider has also the same health as the monsters it can replace.

The only new monster which can be counted as real "additional" is the Afrit (if you set the cvars accordingly).
Jakub had the idea to let him drop some health / ammo, which is not implemented yet....
Maybe I should really consider it more.
But the rest of the pack keeps the balance quite nice.
And doubling the ammo in a map is far too much, yes.
Anyway, if a map is too hard, you can always play it on a lower skill.



Adjustable monster health + inflicting damage and player weapon damage:
You must always consider people, which are not familiar with modifying code. Some SMC users do not even knowhow to openthe autoexec.cfg.
So, from this fact you cannot say that modifying these values is easy. Everything is always relative.
In fact, modifying damage values *can* be harder than one might think.

I think, like others also said, as long as they are adjustable and the default values are the original ones, it really doesnt *hurt* to have those adjustable.



Bleeding monsters:
It is implemented and I personaly love it. It adds more to the game that I thought.
Thank you again for your idea Josh !



Random monsters in a map:
There are mods which do this. But this one is risky / tricky.
Like Josh said: The mapper placed the individual monster carefully and with a good purpose. I think switching them makes the map quite weird.
I know, that the SMC replacement monsters do something similar. But I always had this in mind and tried to avoid issues.
The Hydra and Warlord are 100% replacers for their monster-type.

The Afrit is meant for the Wizard, but can also replace / support all others. So here start a grey zone. The spider (as it was the first replacement) is also able to replace all, but at least it has a meele and ranged weapon.
And both monsters have their replacers health, so I think it is a fair compromise.



Adding dragons into Quake:
First of all. It has already been done. One of the best QC-coders (if not the best) created this work: Patrick. Most of you know his "Drake" mod, which is the official successor of his "Dragon" mod. The source is availabe, so it is very doable.

But most original Quake maps are not designed for such a beast...
The maps area between sky and highest brush is far to small.
Only fan-made maps are *better* usable; but even than, it will still not be perfect.
A map with a dragon should be designed for such a huge flying creature.



Homing missile from Shalrath:
I plan to implement an option to make them shootable / destroyable.
It is very similar to SMC�s "Evil texture monster", which can be killed as well.
Well, it is more or less a homing monster with health.



The problem is, that I have to leave the country for 1 month end of next week.
So I would like to at least give you what I have till then. Noone knows what the future might bring...

So, I will try to implement all the things we discussed since the release of V4.55.
Exception: The health / ammo drop for Afrits.
(You can in the meantime think about a fitting model for the Afrits *backpack*)

Thank you again for your support and interest.


Warm regards in these cold days,
Seven

[CHP669]

I need a help!

Hello!

Sorry for off top, but I'm in the big trouble! I use the latest Darkplaces. Textures, effects, RT lights, etc is O.K.! But! I can't setup the real, "non-old" wall torches - flames! The forums alredy readed A to Z, I found help, but doesn't work. My textures in the game: QRP map & normal map textures(SoA too) so the complete QRP pack with items, NO Rygel's textures! This is my Quake, but the flames is terrible! Can I help someone? Thank you, and sorry for my english, I'm hungarian.