Girls making more complex games than boys

[golden_boy]

Gamasutra - Study: Girls made more complex games than boys, liked dev less

The results show that girls made more complicated, narrative-driven games than the boys overall. For example, the chart below, reproduced from the researchers' article on the study shows that girls used more types of "triggers" in their scripting than boys, who mainly relied on the first one they were taught.

Notice how there is a comparatively huge focus on items and progressing between areas in the girls' games. Quite interesting. Also note how less triggers are attached to killing.

I dare say, if 50% of game developers were women, we'd see a lot more different games.

[Phenom]

Whoop! start programming that Quake 1 Prequel ladies!

Us guys will just fvck it up with killing and pressing of buttons by smashing into them with our foreheads! Sometimes we'll use an axe to press buttons like a barbaric 4 year old but look who coded Quake! All guys!

Step aside Mr.Carmack, here comes the Quake-RPG we were promised!

[golden_boy]

You know, you just kinda proved the point. How do you read all of that into what I posted?

[ArrrCee]

This is pretty interesting! I'd like to see some of the games that were created as to put these design choices into context.

[golden_boy]

This is pretty interesting! I'd like to see some of the games that were created as to put these design choices into context.

I think they didn't make full playable games, they were just given a Neverwinter 2 based construction kit with a visual scripting language where they could create chains of events, and taught how to use that to create mini-games if you will.

What the graphic says is just that girls used more different types of triggers (the same kind of triggers used in Quake maps) to create a broader variety of how events could go down (which in Quake map terms, again, means "more interesting maps.")

Whereas boys tended to use less different kinds of triggers and also used more triggers of the type "when monster is killed, do X."

Girls especially put more triggers that fire when you find items and when you enter new areas (ie more progress or exploration based than what boys did.) Translated to Quake terms, this means girls put (a lot) more weight on "finding the red armour" and "finding a secret area" or "progressing through the game."

As a level designer, to me that looks like girls tended to have more of a high-level "plan" for their scripted events because the elements of collecting items and proceeding between areas occur (a lot) more in the girls' designs than the boys'.

[Mindf!3ldzX]

Seems extremely sexist no matter how you dissect the words. I have never played a game and wondered "Did a girl/guy make this game?"

I'm positive I am not the only one who has this approach, the game is enjoyed or hated on its own merits. I could care less if it was created by snips,snails & puppy dog tails.



THEY made one of those games that I do not regret purchasing, I also bought their season pass. I can play a girl character in the game if I want, but that had zero bearings on whether or not I would drop kick someones face across the map, or twist that melon they call a skull clear around 180degrees snapping their neck. Precisely how it should be.

In my opinion, the internet is the wild west of male activity. The same could be said about female activity, but that wouldn't make for juicy discussions. Quake = definite wild west mentality,the same cannot be said for the modern games I play.

Being a sexist pig? Being a racist? Good luck staying on a server. Clanberries CA had the same implementation going on back in the day, there was zero room for shenanigans that didn't fall into the category of your basic chat / shit talk.

Cursing and derogatory comments would typically result in temp ban's. CatGirl who used to frequent the IHOC/Shmack servers was one of the few girl Quakers who actually had to wade through you're average ignorance to enjoy a game. FUB or "FatUglyBitch" could wear some of that blame, it reached a point where even though myself and her was long time Quaker buds, she no longer chatted in-game.


Now she's gone, I know why that is (not for a fact) but its safe to say, wild west mentality went a long way if not the full mile to making the game not enjoyable,and has since moved on to other things.

I have never seen a reason to grabbing ones own crotch (or feeling out a player) just to verify what sex I'm interacting with in a game. They gonna get it just the same!

I think things COULD be different, but it would have to start @ home and how the growing young men witness the adult men treat their women,be it a wife or daughter.

[ArrrCee]

@goldenboy: Yea, it's really interesting to see what the differences are in thinking between sexes at that age when it comes to designing games. My thought process is, while I said I'd like to see their games, I just meant I would've liked to see the quests or chain of events to see the creativity behind what the kids were making. Seeing it, at least for me, helps to put a study like this into context instead of just numbers and percentages.

Looking through the main article that this was based on, I find it odd that they didn't talk about the action types that are near the bottom right after the triggers. They're pretty equal. I think the real question I would have is why are these 2 different pie chart comparisons so different. Pretty cool!

@Mind: I have to agree with your sentiment that games are games no matter who makes them. I think that difference between people should be looked at as a plus, and not a minus. However, I do remember that some people were very against buying Shadow Complex years ago because it's based on an Orson Scott Card book, who is a renowned author but is also a bigot. So, should you support that game based on that fact? I mean, a game is a game, but hmmm.

I don't understand why gaming has been riddled with all of this race war/sex war stuff lately (some on these very forums). Some times it's understandable as there are awful people who do awful things. But lately, there has been so much digging for controversy that it has become a farce.

Sorry, I don't like getting into this stuff usually so that's all I'll say for now.

Hope you both are having a great day.

[Mindf!3ldzX]

Look no further than (one of) the guy who discovered DNA for a prime example of why it doesn't matter who YOU are versus what YOU provided the world with.

I read the article like 1-2 days ago....


James Watson, Co-Discoverer of DNA and Accused of Racist Remarks, Selling Nobel Prize for Money

Germans basically invented the modern jet engine and rocketry. NASA owes immense credits to Germans. You can be a complete piece of shit as a person but still do great things for the world, even if those great things blossomed out of extremely barbaric or atrocious. When you think of a modern airliner or SpaceX, do you think of Nazi's? Well fuck no!


It's hard to put into words but basically this : When I see people , I see exactly that... PEOPLE. When I watch a NASA documentary, I don't think wow Nazi's we're such 'blah blah blah'.

A flower can smell sweet and look beautiful, but that doesn't mean anyone should dig up the roots of the flower just to find a possible negative roots that started it all. Maybe it's a cross breed of Rose and some other flower, and the person responsible for that particular flower was real asshat. That doesn't mean the gift to the world should be diminished by the particular asshat's own personal beliefs or opinions.

For people like me 'who get it' , its a really tiring discussion trying to explain things to a jerkoff who is set in their ways and not worth MY time. If everyone took my stance, ignorance would be rife.

the best example of awesome vs not awesome?


vs

Guy on the right is infinitely one of my hero's. He's above the bullshit, much like I consider myself now days. I'm above the bullshit, but it helps when you wade through the bullshit as a youth and discover actually how much bullshit you had to wade through to figure it out. The hardest part is how to help others avoid wading through the bullshit,which is impossible. Nothing clicks quite as well as experience.

[R00k]

girls make sex more fuckn complex.

hello soap opera!

girls we like

[golden_boy]

Seems extremely sexist no matter how you dissect the words.

How is it sexist to state that girls did more interesting stuff during a study about game design?

For people like me 'who get it' , its a really tiring discussion trying to explain things to a jerkoff who is set in their ways and not worth MY time. If everyone took my stance, ignorance would be rife.

Please explain what you mean here.

[MadGypsy]

@nazis work for NASA

you are referring to operation paperclip. The thing is, just because we enlisted the greatest rocket scientists in the world (which happened to be Germans WORKING FOR Nazis) It doesnt mean we enlisted Nazi's to form NASA.

However, we DID use top SS members to form the CIA and as the years have gone by that arm of our law is looking more and more NAZI, and its methods/tactics are spreading (have spread) to other arms of our law.

@people like me "who get it"

I wouldnt be so sure of yourself. You turned a simple gaming study into a half baked philosophy of good vs evil. It could be argued that you didn't get it at all. Almost like you wanted to make some point and you picked a thread at random to attribute it to.

I'm not hating on you. I'm just pointing out that you are very confident of unrelated gibberish. The results are in for gb's study... regarding the age, sex and demographic of the participants used. There is nothing to argue or philosophize about regarding the studys results unless you have a study that results to the contrary.

Girls want to hunt for items and press switches, boys want to simply kill shit. I don't think this is so unbelievable or warrants a sex war. Actually, did we realky need a study to figure this out?

[golden_boy]

@nazis work for NASA

you are referring to operation paperclip. The thing is, just because we enlisted the greatest rocket scientists in the world (which happened to be Germans WORKING FOR Nazis) It doesnt mean we enlisted Nazi's to form NASA.

However, we DID use top SS members to form the CIA and as the years have gone by that arm of our law is looking more and more NAZI, and its methods/tactics are spreading to other arms of our law.

Wernher von Braun profited from the Nazi slave labour system neatly enough. He was part of the system. Look up sometime who assembled all his pretty rockets, and under what kind of conditions. von Braun wasn't just "working for nazis" but the nazis actually worked for him.

He once told Neil Armstrong that if things had gone the correct way, he (Braun) would be in jail and Armstrong would be dead in space.

Now how did we get into nazis in a thread about game design and gender?

[Mindf!3ldzX]

clearly to bring MadGypsy back out of the wood work, success?

[MadGypsy]

You know I love me some Nazi's.

Im not really "out of the woodwork" per se but I do/did miss some of y'all and was curious about what y'all have been up to. Also, as much as gb protests his quakeness he actually posts here waaaaay more than he blogs. I'm a fan and always have been so, I'm kinda stuck coming here if I want to see what he's been up to. He is not the only reason I popped in though.

[Mindf!3ldzX]

glad you're back in any capacity. wb