QDP niggles

[Ninepartsred]

I'm running DarkPlaces 20130304 build in Win8 and there are a few niggles:

1 - In Quake, fiends sometimes hang for a couple of seconds mid-attack.

2 - In Scourge, HIP1M2, the centroid is hanging from the ceiling inside the door under the target. It can still be killed and attacks when hit but stays up there.

3 - HIP2M3, there is no silver key! I've followed walkthroughs and I'm sure I'm not missing anything.

Are these known problems?

Any variables I can try?


Thanks in advance.

[talisa]

1 yes this is a known problem with DP, the one of fiends hanging. this is a dp-specific-bug, it sometimes happens when a fiend hits the edge of a brush when jumping.
there is no solution for this so far, only lord havoc could fix this.

2 im sorry but ive never heard of this problem, of a centroid hanging on the ceiling. ive never encountered this bug myself.
might have something to do with that in the latest DP-builds all gameplay fix cvars are disabled. seven will probably be able to tell you exactly with cvar to enable

3 i know there are some other problems with this particular map, like one secret door not fully opening and 2 doors not opening after picking up the horn of conjuration,
but your bug ive never experienced. its there for me as you can see:

[_Smith_]

1 - I've made a workaround for this issue, I've improved it recently and Fiend usually hangs for only a split second now, you can barely notice it.
Additionally made it a bit less prone to jumping loops when blocked on a high step, etc. ( original Quake issue ).
20 min of testing didn't revealed any issues. If it happens to break Fiend another way, disable my change in autoexec.cfg and let me know.

2,3 are probably related to changed default sv_gameplayfix_ cvars values in new builds that have to be changed back. I don't remember which ones exactly currently.

Check a link in my sig.

[Mindf!3ldzX]

the fuck is a niggle and why are we ignoring it.

[Mindf!3ldzX]

niggles 3rd person singular present, plural of nig�gle
Verb
Cause slight but persistent annoyance, discomfort, or anxiety: "a nasty leg wound which still niggled at him".
Noun
A trifling complaint, dispute, or criticism: "it is an excellent book except for my few niggles"; "I have a few niggles about design".

clearly a runner up for most stupid word ever conceived .. 1886 first use. last use 2013

I am determining with your extensive vocabulary you simply chose to use the word niggle instead of a more obvious one due to it having nigg in it, or maybe its a common word that is used in another country.... then again,i'm not under a fn rock bro,I have never heard it used lol. wtf

[golden_boy]

I was recently told that the gold key vanishes in my map gb_palace when played in Darkplaces, too.

Maybe DP does something to the bboxes or the collision, so certain items can fall out of the map?

Is the hip2m3 key there in other engines?

Otherwise I'd say tell this to LH instead of posting it here. As I've said many times, IRC is the way to contact large parts of the Quake modding/programming community.

If you went to #qc or #darkplaces on irc.anynet.org, YOU could be talking to Lord Havoc HIMSELF within LESS THAN 24 HOURS!

The shock!!

[_Smith_]

I think one, or both of these are required to fix models falling through the floor:

"sv_gameplayfix_droptofloorstartsolid" "1"
"sv_gameplayfix_setmodelrealbox" "1"

I've just enabled all sv_gameplayfix_ cvars that were enabled previously via autoexec.cfg in the compilation.

I believe LH disabled them in new builds intentionally and Seven was talking to him recently, so I assume he let him know about it.
Fiend issue was also reported, but the root cause was not found yet.

[Syluxguy28O3]

niggles 3rd person singular present, plural of nig�gle
Verb
Cause slight but persistent annoyance, discomfort, or anxiety: "a nasty leg wound which still niggled at him".
Noun
A trifling complaint, dispute, or criticism: "it is an excellent book except for my few niggles"; "I have a few niggles about design".

clearly a runner up for most stupid word ever conceived .. 1886 first use. last use 2013

I am determining with your extensive vocabulary you simply chose to use the word niggle instead of a more obvious one due to it having nigg in it, or maybe its a common word that is used in another country.... then again,i'm not under a fn rock bro,I have never heard it used lol. wtf

we learn something new everyday brah!

[Seven]

Hello,

The DP gameplay issues 2.) + 3.) we are facing here, have been discussed in several threads in this forum recently (as talisa already mentioned).
The root cause for them (and I bet also for the issue in your map golden_boy) are the sv_gameplayfix_ cvars, which ALL have been disabled by default since 20130301 DP build.
LordHavoc decided to disable all of these cvars to make Darkplaces more compatible with mods.
But it made it less compatible with original Quake and both mission packs…

@ golden_boy,
Your assumption is correct:

Maybe DP does something to the bboxes or the collision, so certain items can fall out of the map?

To see exactly what they do, either look into the .c file or use the "apropos" command to read a description what it does.
Example: If a bbox of an item touches or exceeds a wall-mesh of the map, it will fall out of the map. There has such narrow spaces in Quake and MPs, where items are spawned


They do not need ALL to be enabled, to get rid of these issues.
Only these 3:

sv_gameplayfix_setmodelrealbox "1"
sv_gameplayfix_droptofloorstartsolid "1"
sv_gameplayfix_upwardvelocityclearsongroundflag "1"

I already contacted LH and described it to him, as well as other minor issues.
One of the other issues have been fixed by him. But he does not seem to be a friend of reenabling these sv_gameplayfix_ cvars again...

They are enabled by default in the SMC, and mentioned in the DP-thread, so at least people/users can read about it (but it doesnt seem to be enough as we see here in this thread)...

As long as they are not enabled by default again, we will have Bug-threads like these.


==========================


The demon jump & freeze issue is based on the game mechanics (QC) code.
It tells him to freeze for 3 seconds, when he supposed to touch ground (approx. after 0.6 sec.) but didn’t.
You can simulate it easily by changing world�s gravity (sv_gravity) to a small value (300 for example).

The demon starts to jump in his jump-animation-frame #4
And if he reaches jump-animation-frame #10 without touching a mesh or non-living entity, game-mechanic (QC) tells him to freeze:
self.nextthink = time + 3;
Demon_JumpTouch () function plays an important role in this topic:
It checks if the demon is onground and shall unfreeze him if necessary.
Other engines seem to handle this check differently, as they do not have this issue.

To change this behaviour, you would have to change the qc-code so that he freezes a shorter time or even better: not at all.

Kind regards,
Seven

[MadGypsy]

@ Mindz & words... I can only imagine what you originally thought this (QDP Niggles) meant.

Mindz - "O.O he said niggles and acted like it was no big deal!"

lol

[JDSTONE]

I was recently told that the gold key vanishes in my map gb_palace when played in Darkplaces, too.

This dose fix it.

sv_gameplayfix_setmodelrealbox "1"
sv_gameplayfix_droptofloorstartsolid "1"
sv_gameplayfix_upwardvelocityclearsongroundflag "1"

and it helps if you put the bsp in the map folder and not just floating lose in the game folder. insert face palm hear

[Mindf!3ldzX]

@ Mindz & words... I can only imagine what you originally thought this (QDP Niggles) meant.

Mindz - "O.O he said niggles and acted like it was no big deal!"

lol

that word is to be lol'd at now.

[golden_boy]

Weird, the key in gb_palace does not intersect map geometry.

[Seven]

Weird, the key in gb_palace does not intersect map geometry.

Hello golden_boy,

I downloaded your map and tested it with Darkplaces.
The gold key dissappears, when you do not enable the mentioned sv_gameplayfix_ cvars.
So you can safely play your map without issues when you enable them.

The gold key intersects approx. 3 Quake-digits with the upper geometry of the window cutout.
I made screenshots to better explain it below.

Do not forget that items call StartItem () and then PlaceItem ().
PlaceItem () moves them upwards 6 Quake units and let them droptofloor ().
(maybe this is the reason in this case)

I used sv_freezenonclients to make screenshots at the very beginning of the map.
Here you can see the intersection:



After the item dropped to floor (with gameplayfix enabled):
There is a nice gap between bbox and window cutout:
(the items flag changed to FL_ITEM now, that is why the bbox is bigger):



Please excuse my bad english, but I hope you could see and understand the root cause for the dissappearance of the gold key.
That is why it is important, that LordHavoc enables the above mentioned gameplayfixes again

Best wishes,
Seven

[Spike]

if (!trace.allsolid && trace.fraction < 1)
in a vanilla engine, droptofloor should succeed if the top of the object is in a solid, so long as there's space below for it. Yes, allsolid vs startsolid is nasty, but whatever.
no idea why that doesn't work in dp. it seems to still have that line though.