RQuake -- Wall of Souls

[Bank]

Skulltag might have something to do with Bank's strong feelings for Doom. Perhaps I should try it out one day on Zdaemon.

Skulltag is a port, not a wad.

RQuake = newer than teh owld doom.

By your logic, Halo is the greatest game ever made.

[foq]

You fail to see the point, Bank. DooM is great, but Quake is greater, espically with the new maps RQuake provides.

[Bank]

There are new maps and ports and graphics and etc. for Doom as well. Try Jdoom, making Doom just as 3D as quake.

[scar3crow]

Actually try GZDoom.

The fact is, if were going to be doing age + mods, Quake wins by virtue of age, and it has had a deeper mod community for longer as any real scripting is relatively new to Doom. Both games are great (brought to you by Romero, Peterson, the Carmacks and Hall after all).

This thread already has all kinds of suck written all over it.

[Bank]

Actually try GZDoom.

The fact is, if were going to be doing age + mods, Quake wins by virtue of age, and it has had a deeper mod community for longer as any real scripting is relatively new to Doom. Both games are great (brought to you by Romero, Peterson, the Carmacks and Hall after all).

This thread already has all kinds of suck written all over it.

GZdoom only adds true 3D floors, it still relies on sprites.

and yes, very much so.

http://www.doomworld.com/classicdoom/ports/

Thank you for shopping at Bank.

[scar3crow]

True 3d floors are the more significant aspect, sprites has nothing to do with the 3d aspect of the game. Merely the presentation. Models can be in non true 3d environments, that doesnt make the game 3d. See all the other Doom ports with model support. In the same way, sprites do not make a game non 3d, see the explosions in Quake.

[Monster]

Isn't DOOM in 2 1/2 dimensions?? I remember trying to make a map for it, but it was just a pain in the ass... Very weird for me.. quake mapping was much easier IMO.

[Bank]

True 3d floors are the more significant aspect, sprites has nothing to do with the 3d aspect of the game. Merely the presentation. Models can be in non true 3d environments, that doesnt make the game 3d. See all the other Doom ports with model support. In the same way, sprites do not make a game non 3d, see the explosions in Quake.

Of course, and that's the only reason I've used GZdoom on several occasions. Jdoom also incorperates some aspect of the GZdoom floors (or at least it's been integrated/in the process of to Domsday) but for a casual gamer; especially a quaker, model support would be a welcome luxiary, if not a requirement.

Isn't DOOM in 2 1/2 dimensions?? I remember trying to make a map for it, but it was just a pain in the ass... Very weird for me.. quake mapping was much easier IMO.

Doom has 3D inviroments *sort of*, there isnt a Y axis, althought there can be variations in height, but no true up and down. Players and monsters are represented by 8 sided sprites. There are various ports and plugins that allow for true 3D models.

Doom mapping is significantly difficult because it's all done from a bird's eye, and sectors are a bit iffy. Doombuilder has a pretty nice 3D mode, and several others are in the making(SLADE), or old standbys(wadauthor).

[foq]

Doom is pretty cool, but it's pretty damn hard to beat Q1, and Doom1 doesnt (although zdaemon is pretty addicting at times)

[Bank]

Doom really relied more on quick reflexes and objective based play, as opposed to some of the more laboriously planned parts of Q1 (Shub Niggurath was one, but almost a rip off of Doom 2's Icon of Sin, IE, having to time things just right to win, jumping on the ball in END, firing rockets into the correct place in Icon of Sin)

To say I like quake is an understatement, but to say that I love doom is as well. Quake will never hold the same ground with me as Doom, ever. No game since has as well, and the outrageously large community full of innovations to a thirteen year old game doesnt help. It really is a matter of taste, but Doom marks a time in my life when I truly did become a gamer, quake does not.

[Polarite]

Quake will never hold the same ground with me as Doom, ever.

I can only agree with Bank ,Doom has more ground with me too !
Played that game with my friend over 14.4k modem even before i had an internet connection.

We made maps for it and had alot of FUN,those where the days.

[scar3crow]

Shub Niggurath was one, but almost a rip off of Doom 2's Icon of Sin

That might have something to do with it being made by the same people and also with the intent of being similar to the Icon of Sin...

Quake grabs me more in terms of creating new places, and expanding, it gets my imagination going which I love and I also literally prefer its actual feel in gameplay (player speed, entity collision, friction, acceleration, that stuff), it holds much more for me. Doom and Blood are the next best games in my opinion, however both are limited by the concreteness of their setting to an extent - I have less inclination to wonder about what is going on beyond those walls in either game, it leaves little room for my imagination. In contrast, one can make a case for making continuing levels for both of those games due to the more verbose and evenly gradiented monster set, as opposed to Quake's smaller selection.

Quake is the game I love, Doom was a really awesome girlfriend whom I remain friends with, if that serves as some analogy. Beyond trying to fit my dick through the hole in a cd.

[Baker]

Everyone likes different things and I had an extraordinary amount of fun with Doom II back in the day.

In fact, I still played Doom II with friends over a LAN for 3 years after playing Quake the first time (and not liking it as much as Doom II).

Doom is something you grow out of, Quake is something you grow in to. Doom to me is like playing checkers, Quake is like playing chess. Once you get into chess, there is no going back to liking checkers.

I could still play Doom II and like it, but I wouldn't like it nearly as much as Quake. The only advantage that Doom II has over Quake is that Doom II can be played competently by the keyboard alone and even lightly experienced players can do fairly well, whereas Quake is extremely difficult to master.

[Bank]

While I think you give Doom too little credit, I may pose the question-

Is your imagination so limited that you cannot do something in Doom that is easily possible in quake? I just think it's childish to dismiss Doom just because it's inferior in graphical prowess.

As for the Icon of Sin, I actually expected that id would have some amount of originality left in them, but after thirteen years and nothing but sequels, I cant be sure at all.

Baker, I dont agree at all, I think Doom is something that if you appreciate, will stay with you, I respect quake because of its strives in technology, but it was by no means wall-breaking in the terms of genre. Quake was merely 3D Doom, simple as that.

[scar3crow]

You completely missed the point once again, Doom is a complete vision, it is Deimos, Phobos, Hell, and Hell on Earth. They present it in a completed fashion and the world feels like This Is It to me. Granted if I explore my imagination when I get to it, my mind asks things like "Where did the mancubi come from? Are they composed of wrathful souls that are chained in place and forcefed the mutilated bodies of children?" But it doesnt really go beyond that because Doom is simple and complete, youre facing demons and theyre attacking.

Quake has a myriad nature to itself, the monsters dont all quite match, the settings are different, it feels like you just walked in during the last act of a massive play. This is largely by accident, but it still is a positive trait to me.

Its not about graphics and it never is. Quit trying to make that the scenario.

Quake had a lot more behind it than what got released, the aspects that made it a 3d Quake were composed in a very short period of time because they realized they could not fulfill the vision they had due to external factors and so they retreated to something they could safely create.