What time is Quake set in?

[Amon26]

I used to wonder why betas looked cooler than the final products until I began getting involved in game design. From my experiences the process of making a game starts out with a "sky's the limit" mentality with lots of room for experimentation and brainstorming. In those periods, developers and artists experiment with processes which sometimes end up taking back seat to practicality.

I had a concept for a game wherein the monsters would all be procedurally generated from a database of torsos, legs, and heads. I made a test run of it and it worked just fine, but halfway into the actual game content I realised it was going to cause some serious problems with bounding boxes. The only way I could think of fixing it was to go back and re-draw every asset within strict dimension constraints which would set me back a good 2 months. In the end I chose to create a standard set of monsters that looked good, and behaved properly in order to continue forward.

Anyways, iD says their games will be done "when its done" but like any other developer in the business, they have to assess what works, what doesn't, and what will be the most effective way to create something entertaining within a timespan shorter than Duke Nukem Forever

And in the professional, business side of the whole thing, you have to deal with questions like "if i put this in, will we turn away publishers?" or "is there a market for this type of game?"

it's a headache, and sometimes the end result becomes something much different than what's said in any press release or magazine interview. All you can hope for is that it'll still entertain.

[Grim Warlock]

I used to wonder why betas looked cooler than the final products until I began getting involved in game design. From my experiences the process of making a game starts out with a "sky's the limit" mentality with lots of room for experimentation and brainstorming. In those periods, developers and artists experiment with processes which sometimes end up taking back seat to practicality.

I had a concept for a game wherein the monsters would all be procedurally generated from a database of torsos, legs, and heads. I made a test run of it and it worked just fine, but halfway into the actual game content I realised it was going to cause some serious problems with bounding boxes. The only way I could think of fixing it was to go back and re-draw every asset within strict dimension constraints which would set me back a good 2 months. In the end I chose to create a standard set of monsters that looked good, and behaved properly in order to continue forward.

Anyways, iD says their games will be done "when its done" but like any other developer in the business, they have to assess what works, what doesn't, and what will be the most effective way to create something entertaining within a timespan shorter than Duke Nukem Forever

And in the professional, business side of the whole thing, you have to deal with questions like "if i put this in, will we turn away publishers?" or "is there a market for this type of game?"

it's a headache, and sometimes the end result becomes something much different than what's said in any press release or magazine interview. All you can hope for is that it'll still entertain.

The Development Stage of a Video Game is a good time to play with it. If I ever made a Game, I'd make it as good as. You know I'm trying to hunt down all those early Pre-Releases of Quake III Arena & Doom III, I'll even ask John Carmack for it.

Here's a Screenshot of Quake III Arena Tournament III long before it was released:



Here's a Screenshot of Quake III Arena Tournament III after it was released:



Which one looks better to you? I like the Pre-Q3TOURNEY3 better.

[Amon26]

the colors look a lot more vibrant in the pre-alpha, and the sky is a lot cooler. The texture work still looks muddy compared to the final results. Those particle effects would've eaten up a lot of resources at the time (especially with 12 players in a map) their fog routines were much nicer back then too but it came at a performance cost.

Developers also will sometimes play with an effect, think its really cool, but have to decide where they'll focus the bulk of their time. So they put the experiments on the back burner for the sake of progress, and before they know it.. the game's almost complete and woops, didnt get to spend time working on those effects.

(good example would be to look at the additions to QuakeLive compared to Q3A. Even if you prefer the original Q3A, its obvious that the old maps got some extra TLC put into them)

Also, spend too long tinkering, and you begin to test the patience of your waiting audience.

[Grim Warlock]

the colors look a lot more vibrant in the pre-alpha, and the sky is a lot cooler. The texture work still looks muddy compared to the final results. Those particle effects would've eaten up a lot of resources at the time (especially with 12 players in a map) their fog routines were much nicer back then too but it came at a performance cost.

Developers also will sometimes play with an effect, think its really cool, but have to decide where they'll focus the bulk of their time. So they put the experiments on the back burner for the sake of progress, and before they know it.. the game's almost complete and woops, didnt get to spend time working on those effects.

(good example would be to look at the additions to QuakeLive compared to Q3A. Even if you prefer the original Q3A, its obvious that the old maps got some extra TLC put into them)

Also, spend too long tinkering, and you begin to test the patience of your waiting audience.

Yeah, Quake III Arena was a lot prettier back then, I'm not saying Quake III Arena now is crappy, but if they kept it that way it would've been much better & a much more higher rating instead of "Game of the Year", ID Software would've been much more better if they kept Quake III Arena & Doom III the way they were. It just seems to be more right. It fits Quake & Quake much more. ID Software really should be ashamed of themselves. Quake Live is the worst game they've ever made so far, it's nothing like Quake III Arena, they actually done it now... completely stripped all its gothicness, ambiance & all the fun stuff. And also, Quake II was somewhat different, it actually had Trains that race around the Map in it. Go to this Site: http://nostalgia.poweredbylasers.com/, so you get to see more about Quake's (& other Games') History.

[metchsteekle]

ua i tried playing a ql 1 on 1, didnt work because there were no shadows to slunk around in an disappear into, and the footstep sound is a big drawback on how i play

[Hazza]

Hmm, good question on the "what if" about Quake's development:

On ONE hand, there would probably be twice as many monsters (and guns), more refined quality and EVERY episode would be as good as Episode 1 (pure awesome).
Not to mention there might have been more environments and more expansion on the futuristic elements.

On the other hand, they might have emphasized the medievalness and RPG elements even further (being that was id's original intention)- which is for me already way too much in the game we got. Two knights and a few castles are enough for me- and maybe a dragon; The ogres on the other hand are deliciously contemporary and hardcore (they carry grenade launchers and wield chainsaws).
I'd like to see more of this too (maybe, armoured dwarves slinging around cannons).
It's bad enough that so many modders keep DOING it- even good ones!

If I see one more Hexen imp or wizard, magic potion, wine barrel, medieval town or other sissy RPG element I'm going to go on a rampage- the BAD kind.

Just tell Raven to stop making crappy sequels and make Hexen 3 already!
(after they've played and replayed Elite Force so they know what they're doing!

[eieio]

4:32 pm est.

[Grim Warlock]

Hmm, good question on the "what if" about Quake's development:

On ONE hand, there would probably be twice as many monsters (and guns), more refined quality and EVERY episode would be as good as Episode 1 (pure awesome).
Not to mention there might have been more environments and more expansion on the futuristic elements.

On the other hand, they might have emphasized the medievalness and RPG elements even further (being that was id's original intention)- which is for me already way too much in the game we got. Two knights and a few castles are enough for me- and maybe a dragon; The ogres on the other hand are deliciously contemporary and hardcore (they carry grenade launchers and wield chainsaws).
I'd like to see more of this too (maybe, armoured dwarves slinging around cannons).
It's bad enough that so many modders keep DOING it- even good ones!

If I see one more Hexen imp or wizard, magic potion, wine barrel, medieval town or other sissy RPG element I'm going to go on a rampage- the BAD kind.

Just tell Raven to stop making crappy sequels and make Hexen 3 already!
(after they've played and replayed Elite Force so they know what they're doing!

I like it being to much for me & I like it being to good. And I agree with you, make Hexen III & IV already. You've had long enough. Unless you abandoned it long ago, sad. BRING HEXEN/HERETIC BACK!

4:32 pm est.

I'm not laughing.

[Hazza]

Perhaps- but for me medieval themes (specifically medieval/human history), even done well, start tipping the game more into a different tangent, at very best.

But worse, normally medieval themes carry a lot of negative baggage (sissy-nerdy atmosphere, cliched plot about demons/wizards bringing darkness upon a fair kingdom, bureaucratic councils, Star-Trek-style politics, medieval lifestyles- and things that start to get too out of place.

Even most modders (including ones who are otherwise really good) can't seem to strike the balance, and end up taking me on a trip to Narnia!
The only exceptions are Kell, Necros and Hrimfaxi- who all seem to consciously try to tip the theme balanced between techno and gothic (gothic being rather alien- like the Labyrinth from Hellraiser).

In their case (and in Quake and Armagon) I feel more like I'm taken to a whole dimension full of darkness populated with humanoids who have long lost their sanity and have spent the past few centuries making swords and bulletproof armour, and otherwise staring at walls constantly thinking about eating people. Plus, they probably renovated their formerly functional castle to make it more useful for a inter-dimensional alien/demon/god/evil-person trying to find places to hide his excess alien monsters and demons.
If the author can do THAT, I'm happy!
And of course, keep it regularly anchored in techno-gothic style.

[Grim Warlock]

Perhaps- but for me medieval themes (specifically medieval/human history), even done well, start tipping the game more into a different tangent, at very best.

But worse, normally medieval themes carry a lot of negative baggage (sissy-nerdy atmosphere, cliched plot about demons/wizards bringing darkness upon a fair kingdom, bureaucratic councils, Star-Trek-style politics, medieval lifestyles- and things that start to get too out of place.

Even most modders (including ones who are otherwise really good) can't seem to strike the balance, and end up taking me on a trip to Narnia!
The only exceptions are Kell, Necros and Hrimfaxi- who all seem to consciously try to tip the theme balanced between techno and gothic (gothic being rather alien- like the Labyrinth from Hellraiser).

In their case (and in Quake and Armagon) I feel more like I'm taken to a whole dimension full of darkness populated with humanoids who have long lost their sanity and have spent the past few centuries making swords and bulletproof armour, and otherwise staring at walls constantly thinking about eating people. Plus, they probably renovated their formerly functional castle to make it more useful for a inter-dimensional alien/demon/god/evil-person trying to find places to hide his excess alien monsters and demons.
If the author can do THAT, I'm happy!
And of course, keep it regularly anchored in techno-gothic style.

So Star Trek was made before the Medieval Times? WOW! I never knew they had Cameras back then.

[Hazza]

Star Trek meaning ultra geeky and embarassing to watch scenes consisting of bumbling prissy bureaucrats arguing or deliberating over something really minor and getting upset that they're not getting their way- which falls rather short of real-life politics because from what I've seen it's usually more of some evil greedy dude up to no good and a bunch of smaller evil dudes jumping aboard his schemes- kind of like a more standard shooter when you think about it actually.

I've pretty much felt this way with every scene in every fantasy media and a lot of sci-fi consisting of even one non-royal bureaucrat always using this cliche.
The only exception is Dune- whose politics is awesome.

although on a note, Star Trek astronauts do a LOT of time travelling and a lot of visiting planets that coincidentally match ancient Greece, Rome, Medieval England.

[Grim Warlock]

Star Trek meaning ultra geeky and embarassing to watch scenes consisting of bumbling prissy bureaucrats arguing or deliberating over something really minor and getting upset that they're not getting their way- which falls rather short of real-life politics because from what I've seen it's usually more of some evil greedy dude up to no good and a bunch of smaller evil dudes jumping aboard his schemes- kind of like a more standard shooter when you think about it actually.

I've pretty much felt this way with every scene in every fantasy media and a lot of sci-fi consisting of even one non-royal bureaucrat always using this cliche.
The only exception is Dune- whose politics is awesome.

although on a note, Star Trek astronauts do a LOT of time travelling and a lot of visiting planets that coincidentally match ancient Greece, Rome, Medieval England.

ROFLMFAO LOL! N1! Post approved ! But the new Star Trek Movie's amazing! But Quake before they stripped it was nothing like Star Trek, Politics. It only had Medieval Stuff like Dragons, but not Wizards or anything like that.

[kreaper]

In their case (and in Quake and Armagon) I feel more like I'm taken to a whole dimension full of darkness populated with humanoids who have long lost their sanity and have spent the past few centuries making swords and bulletproof armour, and otherwise staring at walls constantly thinking about eating people. Plus, they probably renovated their formerly functional castle to make it more useful for a inter-dimensional alien/demon/god/evil-person trying to find places to hide his excess alien monsters and demons.

couldnt of said it better myself. it is this feeling/atmosphere that makes quake the coolest game ever. in my opinion. and to add my 2 cents. def set in the not so distant future. teleporting in and out of diff dementions. i remember reading somewhere that the map designers didnt really work together so much, and episodes were kinda thrown together, but the feel is still there. i dont know how they did it. its ridiculous how sweet it is.

[Hazza]

Chris- definitely about the new StarTrek movie- my jaw dropped when I watched it, unprepared for how unexpectedly awesome it is!
And I guess I've played too many custom games which have tacked the themes on- as well as the second expansion.

Cheers Kreaper! I also think it's a good thing the different map designers did their own things and joined them in some ways- adds the extra variety between levels- or a distinct style between episodes, depending on how you use it!

I reckon the best path was to go was to roughly carve out some episodes of different themes (like Quake 3 Arena) and get the team to submit a map or two for each following their own interpretation of a specific subject matter- with a bit of variation of art style, and letting the makers focus on their favourite type more (so the castle mappers make more great castle maps instead of doing basemaps they don't want- and vice versa).

[Amon26]

I imagined Quake maybe as a Kafka-esque story of a humans's ascent to become the great malevolent force of destruction, replacing Shub Niggurath, who perhaps at one point was also a mortal that kept his body and soul in-tact through the ever growing nether-worlds and slain a previous entity.

In the ancient times, various cultures opened the gateway with their obsessive meddling in dark-arts. And in modern times the same rift has been opened with reckless science. Quake is a metaphysical dimension comprised of all the hateful destructive energy of mankind's collective fury.

So Quake1 We follow a soldier's story... But before that maybe it was a lone knight who found himself wandering his king's castle to find his bretheren posessed by the madness. Being forced to slay them he finds the underground temple of the preists and at the altar radiates a black hole full of stars. He steps in.

just my idea.