WorldSpawn official WIP thread

[Mugwump]

I'm starting to lose faith in your comprehension skills.

Please don't be condescending. I'm an intelligent man and if I don't understand something it's merely by lack of knowledge.

If after all that you still don't get that the map editor is the game editor I don't know what to tell you.

Does one design a model in a map editor? Nope. Does one animate a model in a map editor? Nope. Does one create music or sounds in a map editor? Nope. Does one paint textures in a map editor? Nope. Sure, I could build a game using only pre-existing assets in a map editor, but that's not exactly akin to developing an original game, more like using Game Maker. I could take care of the music part, but that's about it.

Edit:

And Alex Jones doesn't sound like Time.

Yeah, about that: don't you think that title is a little misleading? People that could be interested in the content of that thread might not even look at it because of the title.

Just noticed your new signature. Pantera, cool. You have good taste in bands with dead members... Reading the lyrics, is this a jab at your self-appointed nemesis? Looks like it.

[Dutch]

IMHO, making this engine Quake-dependent would doom it.

Look at the advanced engines we have now. There are a handful of people that crank those engine's features to the max. I'm not just talking fancy texture replacements, I'm talking all-out particle effects, CSQC HUDs, realistic lighting, crazy experiemtation, on and on and on. Seven and Nahuel instantly come to mind.

I understand some of the lack of interest comes with lack of detailed documentation. But let's consider the fact that almost on a daily basis, someone is starting a thread asking how to boot up Quake on DOSbox, or how to achieve the lowest resolution known to mankind, or how to get those square blood particles back, or stating how totally freaking awesome a 1998-style replacement model is versus the 1996 vanilla model, or how cool it is that QuakeSpasm will actually play music.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of traditional Quake as well (although I prefer at least 800x600 resolution lol). But the interest for a high-performance engine just isn't as strong it seems. Most Quakers like their Quake old-school. Modders like old-school cause it's easier to mod. Deathmatchers like old-school cause fancy effects drop your framerate. Campaginers like old-school because, by golly, that's the only way to play Quake!

If gypsy's engine - with all of it's features thus far - caters to Quake and Quake alone, it will die a slow and miserable death. Kinda like being gut-shot from 900 yards with a big sluggish bullet...the kind with no exit wound.

It's a lot of effort on his part, to the point where it needs to see widespread use and possibly some monetary gain. I doubt the niche market of Quake can provide that.

Just my take on it, at any rate.

[Mugwump]

Dutch

I'm not telling you to back up and make it for Quake, we already have plenty of engines. I'm just a tad disappointed because of your original presentation of it as a Quake engine.

I believe this covers your first point.

If gypsy's engine - with all of it's features thus far - caters to Quake and Quake alone, it will die a slow and miserable death. (...) It's a lot of effort on his part, to the point where it needs to see widespread use and possibly some monetary gain.

I don't doubt that and I wish him all the best with this engine. The fact is that at the moment, as an aspiring mapper with a concern for inter-engine compatibility, it's just not for me. If I become good at mapping and get more ambitious to the point of wanting to make a full game, then maybe the situation will change.

[MadGypsy]

Dutch gets it.

And to add to what Dutch said. Even though this engine is my "figure it out" engine. I absolutely intend to make a game in it and I also intend to primarily target Android. I already have the spot in my code waiting to plug AdMob into it. I want to make money.

There is no Quake engine that is designed to make money through google ad services. At least none I am aware of. The cool thing is, I don't intend to make this engine proprietary so, that means YOU can make money and you don't have to give me a dime. You can make a game in a similar fashion to how you would make a Quake map, package it, upload it to google play and get adbucks relative to how hard you promote your game. I have ideas on how to have my engine point back to a url you designate and essentially kick google out of the equation by pushing custom "ads" back to the engine promoting every game you made after the first one. This is awesome. Think about it. You make an ad driven free game - whenever you are ready you push an ad back to the engine for your new "not free" game (or another free one that keeps those mini bar ads rolling). The engine can then download and install the game eliminating the situation where someone has like 10 instances of my engine on their device cause they downloaded 10 games. I'm nowhere near this part. There are kinks in the system and more to consider but, this is where this is all going.

If the only reason you make games is so people will play them you will wake up one day "hungry on the shores your Fathers have conquered" LOL

This pretty much all started when I couldn't find an engine that would pay me without me having to pay first. That's not the only reason I started this but it was definitely a driving factor. Other reasons include - I hate Javascr...errr QC, I wanted more control, I like highly complicated projects, Baker said I couldn't do it, more...

[Mugwump]

I absolutely intend to make a game in it

And I'll be looking forward to playing it.

The engine can then download and install the game eliminating the situation where someone has like 10 instances of my engine on their device cause they downloaded 10 games.

You really have awesome ideas!

BTW, did that link to the article about Perlin noise help you figure it out?

[MadGypsy]

@link

I'm sorry I forgot to thank you about that. Yes, your link was helpful and I have a decent film grain. If I posted a pic you wouldn't really be able to tell. I made it very subtle but I also made it

"film_grain":
	{	"randomSeed":500,
		"low":0,
		"high":32,
		"options":15,
		"grayScale":true
	},

external.

options are channels to affect where
r =1
g = 2
b = 4
a = 8

and to affect multiple channels you simply add the numbers together for those channels. Like flags in Quake...exactly like flags. However, randomSeed is not random. It's a lie. To make it random you just...

"randomSeed":"random*500"

My script checks whether it's a number type or string type before assigning it. If it's a string type it must be a math expression... yadda yadda yadda

@and I would play it

Not only would you play it but you would play it without having to look at a single ad. Just because GooglePlay/Microsoft Store would have the ad version, it doesn't mean that's the version you would have to use. You "have a guy" for that....LOL.

I'm so dumb . @"have a guy". My GF needed some hair bands and I imeadiately turned into a member of the mob "I got a guy for that." lololol. The next day I called her... "You remember that thing you needed. You know. The 'thing'. I called my guy." (as I was leaving Walgreens with her hairbands)

Ol' Mikey 10 Fingas...came through with the hair bands

[Mugwump]

@thanks It's OK, I didn't ask for that, just to know if it helped. You're welcome anyway, and I'm glad it did help.

@ads Yeah, those are a pain in the tucci!

@"have a guy" I'm sorry, there must be a reference I don't get here. What's that "have a guy" thing?

[MadGypsy]

@You really have awesome ideas!

I hope so. I never stop thinking about this, even in my sleep. My dreams lastnight primarily consisted of me really being trapped inside my engine and attempting to invent a way to get out. I had strange control. Basically I could program the world around me while I was in it but there were "millions of hornets" (ie problem after problem).

@have a guy - say it like an italian mobster. All those Italian mobsters, they all had a guy, for everything. I mean probably in a very stereo-typical way but, whatever.

[MadGypsy]

It begins

[Mugwump]

My dreams lastnight primarily consisted of me really being trapped inside my engine and attempting to invent a way to get out. I had strange control. Basically I could program the world around me while I was in it but there were "millions of hornets" (ie problem after problem).

"Can you feel it, Mr. Anderson? Closing in on you?"

say it like an italian mobster.

Ah, yes, it makes more sense now.

[MadGypsy]

@spike - I know you are trying to trick me with shit like this

//essentially choosing a clipnode like clipnodes[n] (figuratively)
node = ctx->clipnodes + num;

and

//ints as booleans
int side;
side = t1 > 0
if(side)

but it ain't gonna work

out of curiosity... does C(whatever this is) not have true booleans? IE it's all just 0|1 with no actual true|false constants?

:cracks knuckles: :brews coffee:

[Mugwump]

N00b question: what's the difference between 0/1 and true/false? They both look like yes/no to me.

[MadGypsy]

essentially nothing but clarity.

true|false is an answer to a question
1|0 are numbers

imagine

var num = true*10;

it would work (depending if your compiler is lenient) but it's not very clear.

My compiler would say "Boolean used where Number expected"

this would be the fix and it just makes the above even dumber

var num = int(true)*10;

it's better to do this

var bool:Boolean = true;
var num:int = (bool)?10:0;

I'm actually surprised you can even get away with this in C(flavor)

var n:int = num>0;

I can't even do that in flash, variable typing is too strict. I don't think you can do that in Javascript either (not sure really).
I'd have to change that to

var n:Boolean = num>0;
or at least cast it
var n:int = int(num>0);
or
var n:int = (num>0) as int;

Another thing to consider is not (!)
var n:int = !1;
var n:int = !true;

would turn the whole line red before I even got to the 1 or the true. You can't "not" a number. You can not a boolean cause there are only 2 possibilities. What does !1 equal? 984269846298469868742? Who knows? In my environment it equals an error.

[Mugwump]

Thanks. I even learned more than expected! Now I know ! means not (I didn't understand != in one of your previous examples, now I do).

[MadGypsy]

Cool, I'll teach you something else

var bool:Boolean = true;
var num:int = (bool)?10:0;

the second line, after the equal sign is called a ternary statement.

(if)
?then
:else

it is the very short way of writing

var bool:Boolean = true;
var num:int;

if(bool) num = 10
else num = 0;

IF bool is true THEN num equals 10 ELSE num equals 0
var num:int = (bool)?10:0;

you can chain it

(if)
?then
else if)
?then
:else

on and on

you can't

var num:int = (bool)?10;

instead do

if(bool) num = 10;

or even

(bool) num = 10;

in some languages (not AS3)