How To Revive Quake

[omix2]

I read this, and then I laughed. and laughed. and laughed.

I hope no one takes this seriously. You can't just generalize everyone that doesn't like the game being watered down as "dead-enders."

If you don't like the idea of 20 runes and 100000 damage rocket splash radius you are a "dead-ender" and just want the death of quake. Classic.

[Baker]

If you don't like the idea of 20 runes and 100000 damage rocket splash radius you are a "dead-ender" and just want the death of quake. Classic.

I'd ask the MDeautrux guy with the new server to install Rapture's new CA+ on the server he has setup. He could call it caplus.quakeone.com and it could be added to the front page server browser block.

I'd ask for admin as well and see what he says. I think the server is in St. Louis, like the Shmack servers so if you are lucky you'll have 15-25 ping there.

[Frenzy]

Clearly Quake cannot be revived. These "Dead Enders" you speak of, they are all CA'ers. You can't revive quake with 90% of the community wanting to play DM3 for 10 hours a day. In my own opinion, those players that play DM3 all day, are trash in quake overall. They ruin the scene in itself because when some of us vote other maps, it doesn't get changed. An auto-rotation needs to be put into place so this doesn't happen. I'm simply frustrated to the point that you don't even see me on the servers anymore because it's DM3, DM3, DM3, DM3, and then a little more DM3, topped off with some more DM3.

You people who I'm talking about are ruining the game. And you know it.

You have to create a mod that's not CA based, as CAx is. Everybody's effort has been put into CA and it's ridiculous. We are killing the community as a whole with all this CA bullshit.

[Rampage]

Clearly Quake cannot be revived. These "Dead Enders" you speak of, they are all CA'ers. You can't revive quake with 90% of the community wanting to play DM3 for 10 hours a day. In my own opinion, those players that play DM3 all day, are trash in quake overall. They ruin the scene in itself because when some of us vote other maps, it doesn't get changed. An auto-rotation needs to be put into place so this doesn't happen. I'm simply frustrated to the point that you don't even see me on the servers anymore because it's DM3, DM3, DM3, DM3, and then a little more DM3, topped off with some more DM3.

You people who I'm talking about are ruining the game. And you know it.

You have to create a mod that's not CA based, as CAx is. Everybody's effort has been put into CA and it's ridiculous. We are killing the community as a whole with all this CA bullshit.

We have to integrate another CTF day say thursday, and start some CTF based tourney on 3wave or even a CA based tourny on Roots.

roots.quakeone.com, they have an automatic 5 map rotation that Phenom instilled.

We play there pretty often.. especially because DM3 is so repetitive.

[Mindf!3ldzX]

anyone seeking to learn the ropes of Quake, is going to be facing a very very hard learning curve, and hypothetically very rude behavior along the lines of chatting due to many opting in for trash talk or whatnot to further deride their opponent.

nearly anyone truely being "new to quake" has bound to have played an online first person shooter , and has been exposed to worse trash talk from the newer FPS games that are out their and availible,so I doubt anything said in-game is going to effect whether they stay and play or not,just the same as with the learning curve you mentioned,once again if they even remotely show an interest in downloading Quake in a legal form to play online, they have more than likely,not garunteed for everyone,but most possible newcomer gamers have more than likely been exposed to variances of newer games/mods , and the learning curve is rather easy once you simply get in there and play.

on another note ~
It's not so much that everyone is putting their efforts into CA,nor the fact that CA revolves so much around DM3. I'd be willing to bet that if someone came up with a fresh idea for a Quake mod that could have an broad spectrum of appeal to both new players and veteran players , then the coders that are still around would take on such a project...

But bitching about what you dislike about current status-quo Quake wont change anything.

ps : Quakers come and go,but in aspects of first person shooting games,Quake has no equal,and nothing comes close. I've been in this game for the long haul since about 96 based solely for "Online Play" , and got it the year it was released as a christmas present,and played the demo before it was released. I want nothing less than Quake either surviving,or flourishing, and I agree, CA+DM3 WILL NOT make quake flourish, but its keeping gamers in Quake, so it IS doing good by the community of NetQuake by keeping it populated,just like RuneQuake is doing at shmack, which means there is nearly always two different mods in the USA for anyone to play. CA and RQ are the heavyweights right now in popularity,this cant be denied.


Rook , I honestly wish there was a way to completely 100% bridge the Quakeworld and Netquake gap. This would be the holy grail of getting Quake to a point where it can be brought into the limelight in the years to come.

[scar3crow]

and has been exposed to worse trash talk from the newer FPS games that are out their and availible,so I doubt anything said in-game is going to effect whether they stay and play or not,

The presence of 2girls1cup will not make me set goatse as my wallpaper, no matter how exposed I have been to the former. The presence of bad behavior elsewhere does not excuse it here.

If you think that newer games are comparably difficult to online Quake, then you clearly have not played them. Hand holding seems to be the paramount design theme of the past decade, and getting lumped into an arena of hard knocks (even if they're not bashing you incessantly for not being better than them) with no mercy is merely going to be an exercise in frustration, and will create a divide significant enough to be comparable to experiencing sporadic crashing from the game. Due to circumstances beyond your control (whereas the crash is the responsibility of the coder, and the merciless slaying is the action of the veteran) you find yourself helpless to move forward with any significant measure of success. At which point, there is little incentive to stick around.

I want nothing less than Quake either surviving,or flourishing, and I agree, CA+DM3 WILL NOT make quake flourish, but its keeping gamers in Quake, so it IS doing good by the community of NetQuake by keeping it populated,just like RuneQuake is doing at shmack, which means there is nearly always two different mods in the USA for anyone to play. CA and RQ are the heavyweights right now in popularity,this cant be denied.

It didn't keep me in, in fact it pushed me away with its idiotic concept of what Quake was, stripping it down to something more bare than id1, stripping down the map selection. It is Quake Lite. CA and RQ are heavyweights in popularity by your count because you are not counting the players who would like to play something else. I know many players who find shmack's incarnation of RuneQuake to be too chaotic for the sake of any fun, and find CA to be outright boring. Winning by a landslide victory with 10% of the vote does not mean the vast majority supports you, but rather that your supporters are concentrated in the places where you do count. And nearly always two different mods? TWO? This is fucking Quake we are talking about here, the game that launched a thousand great mods, and the mod scenes of a thousand games to come and you want to tout that we have two mods? Maybe if server operators reacted to more than the presence of these small island communities and tried something else, one of the older mods that are tried and true for multiplayer but seem to be growing more and more absent...

You can't revive quake with 90% of the community wanting to play DM3 for 10 hours a day.

These people are not 90% of the community. They're not even 90% of this community, but they act as a mob. They just prefer Quake Lite, which stagnates.

I remember now why I stopped posting here. This is not the only Quake community, its not even 1 of 2. It isn't netQuakers and QuakeWorlders, the community is much larger than any of us know, but there is a lack of communication, and thus a short-sightedness about who is around us.

You can talk about reviving QuakeOne, but I am interested in unifying Quake as it actually is, and bringing new players into the fold.

[omix2]

I really think we need to remove constant DM3 as well. See if dread will agree to make the server force rotation of maps and disable voting. If they complain / quit / bitch / whine then they were the problem we've been having all along anyways.

[Frenzy]

I really think we need to remove constant DM3 as well. See if dread will agree to make the server force rotation of maps and disable voting. If they complain / quit / bitch / whine then they were the problem we've been having all along anyways.

This is so true. If the OWNERS of the servers would set the mod's to rotate, I feel there would be more players. For example, on Roots, the map is played twice, then rotates.

Dredd.quakeone.com was a beautiful server that Phenom and Baker had started. The server was getting a lot of play, and was gaining a lot of popularity, why it went down, I don't know, but I do know that Phenom has roots up now, and it does rotate, and that's fucking awesome.

[Baker]

Dredd.quakeone.com was a beautiful server that Phenom and Baker had started. The server was getting a lot of play, and was gaining a lot of popularity, why it went down, I don't know, but I do know that Phenom has roots up now, and it does rotate, and that's fucking awesome.

After a couple of months, the buzz of the server morphed into being a "political statement against Rage". People play to have fun, not take sides or make a statement.

The server was fun as hell.

I really think we need to remove constant DM3 as well. See if dread will agree to make the server force rotation of maps and disable voting. If they complain / quit / bitch / whine then they were the problem we've been having all along anyways.

Don't forget to ask MDeautrux guy to see if he will switch his server to Rapture's new CA+. There isn't a need for 3 identical clone CAx servers in the near-Chicago region (speaknow, roots, this new server).

[Phenom]

Dredd.quakeone.com was a beautiful server that Phenom and Baker had started. The server was getting a lot of play, and was gaining a lot of popularity, why it went down, I don't know, but I do know that Phenom has roots up now, and it does rotate, and that's fucking awesome.

Dredd.quakeone.com is still up and running with custom maps.

Somehow the server got turned off (Avalanche had to restart it.)

Its definitly up and running though

[Frenzy]

Dredd.quakeone.com is still up and running with custom maps.

Somehow the server got turned off (Avalanche had to restart it.)

Its definitly up and running though

Yes, but I think more of the community pings better to roots.quakeone.com , and that rotates, so it's pretty similar, and AWESOME. Anyways, you need to add some more maps into the rotation, GENDM1, SKULL, etc, imo

[Mr.Burns]

So to recap some of the ideas suggestions, please jump in here if I have misunderstood:

The ideal server would have an abundance of custom maps which would automatically rotate and avoid the dm3 forever problem. This is already the case in almost all the popular euro servers and could also broaden the appeal for new players coming along hoping to see something other than the "same old maps" (as one returning player actually said to me the other night).

To encourage an overlap between NW and QW players it might be an idea to see Quake engines capable of being used for both.

(Huge great gold star goes to Mindz and Rapture...) It may make things more attractive to players, modders and server owners if the idea of a 'Mega'-mod was explored to the full. Server owners could have one progs.dat which could provide the features of multiple mods in one. Rocket guy has gone some way down this path with his bigfoot server which (i believe) can be switched between rq/dm/ca/ra but it could offer so much more. Imagine being able to jump on a server and vote on/off runes, deathmatch plus weapons and Painkeep weapons together/seperately or have vanilla DM / Slide / CA/RA as required. If the server owners would prefer to stick to one mod then they could have an override. Just as an example, up until recently Zop was looking at porting the Painkeep weapons across to the Deathmatch Plus mod on Polarite's server. It would then be a case of players typing vote-painkeep to activate the new weapons.
At this point Spooks readies himself excitedly for the Painkeep farting can'o' beans hunt :d

As there appears to be a reasonably strong CA/RA player base perhaps leave some servers pretty much as is, thus retaining and satisfying most of the existing players, but modify some settings on other 'newbie friendly' servers to broaden the appeal to newcomers. The server admins should decide which type of server they wish to run based on their player base

Someone made the point about the comments passed in-game not going to effect whether new players stay and play or not. To be honest although there is a certain amount of truth in the fact that many but certainly not all hardened online gamers wouldn't be phased by this, the same may not be true for newbies. In fact at least 2 newcomers I know of have gone elsewhere after playing at shmack and the like as a result of the barage of bullshit they endured whilst trying to play. Maybe some client side mute function may be a suitable countermeasure for each engine (eg. mute player # in console).

As at least 2 of the main contributors to Quake seem to listening in to this thread are any more ideas/suggestions?

[Spirit]

Merging NQ and QW people is not possible. The difference is in physics and prediction. Neither the NQ people nor the QW folks will give up "theirs".

[scar3crow]

Merging NQ and QW people is not possible. The difference is in physics and prediction. Neither the NQ people nor the QW folks will give up "theirs".

I will. I've played both plenty. I will play where my friends are, where the maps are fun, where the gameplay isn't stagnant or inanely focused. Granted I am no elite player, my skill is not based on the smaller differences in physics that they have - though I suspect I perform better in netQuake protocol than QW protocol, but that really doesn't matter so much unless my only concern in Quake is winning. And if thats the case, meh.

Obligatory DarkPlaces pimping: this is why I like DP. I don't have to be concerned with the protocol, only whether or not I have the maps/mod being used on the server if it contains any new progs. I just play Quake.

[Mr.Burns]

Merging NQ and QW people is not possible. The difference is in physics and prediction. Neither the NQ people nor the QW folks will give up "theirs".

Sorry, must be my mistake. From reading through some of the contributions it sounded as though DP already had some capabilities in that area.

However, I would humbly suggest that the ideal scenario would be if a player loads up their Quake client (DP for example) and go to an inbuilt server browser (already available in QRack) where they could see all the busy NQ and QW servers to which they could instantly connect (NQ ones already available in Qrack) then they would be much more inclined to try QW and ideally the reverse would be true. This way no one would have to give up anything, except R00k/Baker's spare time :d, . It would make the engine of choice a little more robust, could open up the playing field and hopefully get some 'cross traffic' between protocols, i.e. QW players coming back to try NQ. I wouldn't be suprised if the last paragraph from scarecrow's post encapsulates a common feeling amongst many players.

Although it seems a good idea, whether it becomes a reality or not is really a matter for Baker/Rook/etc. Perhaps this should be a 'back burner' item and the powers that be should focus on some of the other items already mentioned that seem to have a greater support within the player base (*cough, mega mod, cough * )


Kind regards

Monty