Options For A Free OpenSource "Quake" Download

[QuakeRoot]

To complete a project, a project requires:
1. A commitment to do it.
2. A leader
3. Sacrifices.
4. Hard work.
5. Occasionally doing hard things you do not want to do.
6. Helpful: That someone has completed a past project of the same theme but with a smaller scope.

How many of these boxes would you personally check?

I'd put a check next to 1-5. I don't have previous projects. I do currently have something I'm working on, but I've not released anything.

You know how in multiplayer, experienced players trash talk to see how you will react as a measure of sizing you up (do you run in fear? Do you put your gameface on? Do you brush it off and double down, letting your gameplay speak for you?)

Do I run in fear - I'm assuming you want honest answers and not bullshit. Yes, I do - but I run back also. If I need to work on several small projects before beginning something this ambitious, then so be it.

Do *I* have the stuff to make this work on my own? Do I have all the Kung Fu and "Know-How?" no. I'm still learning, and find myself closer to square one than I'd like to admit - but I do have something, and I do have gumption.

Do you bring credibility or fear? Do you show commitment or wanna run? Do you seem like you could captain the ship? This happens because a prerequsite for any project is members that are aren't afraid of their own project and have the self-confidence that breeds more confidence among other participants.

Good points, I can't answer those as they are more rhetorical statements. If this project has the possibility of life, I'd like to see it live. If all I do is empower others - then at least I can do that.

[Baker]

If this project has the possibility of life, I'd like to see it live. If all I do is empower others - then at least I can do that.

I recommend:

1. Defining the project as clearly as possible.
2. Start to recruit a team. People here, at Func_Msgboard maybe, at MODDB, maybe even within the Xonotic community. A lot of the Xonotic peoples are interested in making new things and no doubt that isn't is limited to Xonotic.
3. Come up with a strategy for an initial and imperfect alpha release, figure out what needs done.
4. Maybe do a MODDB project page.
5. Occasionally do a screenshot showing something new created, or a YouTube video.

The "leader" does not have be the "best developer". The leader could just be mostly a communications guy that coordinates among other members of the group.

You might even decide to join a project or another and make some connections.

[Baker]

@Quakeroot: Check private messages ...

[sock]

The best thing you can do at this point is create a document planning out what the project will be about. Once you have a high level plan then you can start finding people and assigning small sections to others. When I mean high level I mean something like:

* Game play, what is the core mechanics
* Art direction and style (concepts, models, textures etc)
* Code dependencies, what engine, what language
* Level design, editor, gameplay ideas, final/test maps
* Testers, checking consistency of the game, assets and playing
* Marketing, how are you going to get people interested

Generally speak the marketing person is usually the creative director/idea's person as well. They are the vision, direction, determination and the voice to get people buzzing and doing stuff. Don't under estimate this role because without marketing your project will never last long enough to get anyone interested.

Also more than anything else, get people that like each other, the technical side of things is never the deal breaker, finding people that can work with each other and enjoy themselves is probably the key to success on community project.

[QuakeRoot]

Please tell me what ya'll think, where these ideas can be improved, and what you want to see added yourself. These ideas are not (currently) set in stone. I need your thoughts, something to bounce them off of.

What engine would be best? I'm partial to EngineX - in my opinion, Quake in EngineX make Quake MORE QUAKE. I like DarkPlaces, but I think it's over-hyped and over-used.

I would like to convert Quake into Java. While this may sound a bit odd, I think it has a lot of merit. Java is a HOT language right now in the market. The whole reason I wanted to learn programming is to mod out Quake, when I found no (entry-level step by step) tutorials I started learning Java - and... it's hard as hell - with no programming experience. I would like to provide a source for aspiring programmers, I think Quake would be a good learning playground.

It's difficult learning to program when writing programs you don't like, for instance: a program that pulls stock quote data from a site, re-arranges the info and spits it out in categories depending on the user needs... while this is useful - it's difficult for a beginner to push through something that dry. If right out the gate you're programming, using something interesting... you're going to learn faster, and the frustration level will be minimal.

After this project is wrapped up, I'm going to be making numerous video tutorials on how to learn Java using Quake (That is... if this programming Quake in Java is a direction that gains a following). Take a look at Jake2, it was a project to convert QuakeII to Java, and it works very effectively http://bytonic.de/html/jake2.html]Bytonic Software

I want all new content, Textures, Models, Sounds, Animation - All monsters should be similar in some ways yet obviously different works. I want the Rottweiler to be more effective and be seen more. I want Shub-Negaruth to be an entirely different, horrifying, STRIKING model. I want male and female players, but personally I think pornographic or near pornographic females (while fun) is not in-line with the thought-and-feel of Quake. If near-naked chicas are something you need to see in Quake... What are you doing here? Go play OpenArena.

I want the Hammer created that was originally promised, (The earliest information released described Quake as focusing on a Thor-like character who wields a giant hammer, and is able to knock away enemies by throwing the hammer -complete with real-time inverse kinematics) and I don't mean the hammer that we got in the "Expansion." A Really fricking "Thor-Hammer" that can be thrown, and if you have the ammunition, charged with lightning. I'd like to see it with an Over-Charge option that can do some heavy damage, but in turn damages the player too. I don't want this weapon to be too-godly - the hammer cannot return "clipping" through a wall, is stops dead and hits the ground, you have to retrieve it.

The original levels will, of course, be used (as they've been released to GPL) - I'd like to have a completely new episode (8 levels) built into Single-Play (Aztec style?) and 10 new levels for Multiplay.

I want 4 (Single-Play) "Bosses" created, one for each episode (except the 1rst which already has a boss) with the difficulty increasing incrementally when facing each Boss. I don't have plans for any additional monster models, that's up to anyone after the original project is complete.

Please tell me what ya'll think, where these ideas can be improved, and what you want to see added yourself.

------EDIT-----
I've also been fascinated by playing a monster in single play and multiplay. The option to play a fiend (Jumping around like a badass!! god that would be fun), that can pick up armor, but no weapons, or an ogre that picks up armor and grenades but nothing else.

[Baker]

You should use DarkPlaces and have the content where possible be backwards compatible with other engines.

Any engine can eventually add features, but you need to be working with an engine that is flexible for modding, has a set of established standards.

Do you want to be stuck with Quake .mdl for every model? No. So use DarkPlaces.

And the type of people who know how to make content and textures are very familiar working with it, and if you plan to use existing Xonotic at all, you can't do that without DarkPlaces.

[Mindf!3ldzX]

Super snip

About the Rottweiler, IMO they fucked that monster up 100% , case in point : Since when do Rottweiler's move at a measily pace,closer to that of a human being.


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VF_qGaif4m0]How fast can a rottweiler run? - YouTube[/ame]

It should have been atleast 2-3 times faster than the player was able to move at!!!

[QuakeRoot]

You should use DarkPlaces and have the content where possible be backwards compatible with other engines.

Any engine can eventually add features, but you need to be working with an engine that is flexible for modding, has a set of established standards.

Do you want to be stuck with Quake .mdl for every model? No. So use DarkPlaces.

And the type of people who know how to make content and textures are very familiar working with it, and if you plan to use existing Xonotic at all, you can't do that without DarkPlaces.

Thanks Baker, your points are, as always, very well put. DarkPlaces it is.

[QuakeRoot]

About the Rottweiler, IMO they fucked that monster up 100% , case in point : Since when do Rottweiler's move at a measily pace,closer to that of a human being.

It should have been atleast 2-3 times faster than the player was able to move at!!!

I completely agree Mindz! Rots are amazing animals. I think they should be much faster, with improved AI, able to jump off of platforms, and hunt in packs of 2-4. The model needs to be a bit bigger, and the skin needs to be 'less-undead', imo.

[Mindf!3ldzX]

LOL, indeed. Like on E1M1 , the Rottweiler thats on the lift/ledge area leading to the NailGun. The only way he can get down from the ledge area , is to ride the lift AFTER you have already initiated the damn thing.


Another thing that is completely f'd up, is the Quake "player" (you) , are the only one who can activate buttons (OR EVER ACTIVATE FN BUTTONS FOR THE MATTER,LIFTS,AND OTHER SHIT).


since when does the outsider know more about the "Enemy Base" than the badguys that INHABIT/USE the damn base. I understand there may have been limitations, but after discussing these things with you QuakeRoot, I can easily find the flaws in logic. Especially the part where "bad guys are too ignorant to operate their own fn bases" part, its just ludacris to the max.

[Baker]

since when does the outsider know more about the "Enemy Base" than the badguys that INHABIT/USE the damn base. I understand there may have been limitations, but after discussing these things with you QuakeRoot, I can easily find the flaws in logic. Especially the part where "bad guys are too ignorant to operate their own fn bases" part, its just ludacris to the max.

The Enforcers, grunts and the dogs aren't from "Quake" dimension. They are from here. The Enforcers, grunts and rottweilers aren't themselves any more. They aren't intelligent any longer.

Something about the slipgates has affected them. Like in a horror movie ...

Similar to the premise "we invented these teleporters and they go somewhere, but where they go is an evil dimension."

Every Quake episode map starts on Earth: E1M1 = The Slipgate Complex, E4M1 = The Sewage System.

Those aren't in the "Quake" dimension. Only after you go through the end of map Slipgate --- which on a base level is always a machine --- are you in this "other place".

So the Enforcers, grunts and the rottweilers wouldn't otherwise be your enemies -- but something is "wrong".

[sock]

Another thing that is completely f'd up, is the Quake "player" (you) , are the only one who can activate buttons (OR EVER ACTIVATE FN BUTTONS FOR THE MATTER,LIFTS,AND OTHER SHIT).

The original AI for quake is as dumb as bricks and if you want this project to be anything slightly modern you will need to spend a huge amount of time writing AI code and making endless test maps to make sure the AI do cool stuff.

I don't want to blow my own trumpet but I do recommend you check out the AI in my MOD In The Shadows. The AI can path around the maps, hunt down the player in packs, operate buttons, open routes and even jump off ledges they are stuck on initially. Playing against AI that look like they know what they are doing is big thing for me but don't underestimate the effort it will take to get the AI to path around obstacles and move around a simple split level room.

[sock]

About the Rottweiler, IMO they fucked that monster up 100% It should have been atleast 2-3 times faster than the player was able to move at!!!

Umm there are technical and game design reasons for AI moving slower. If monsters move too fast they having problems turning (will need different speeds and better AI code), moving up and down steps (movetogoal code) too fast is not possible because of very restrictive bounding boxes and finally fast AI can be really hard to track for new players.

[R00k]

The original AI for quake is as dumb as bricks and if you want this project to be anything slightly modern you will need to spend a huge amount of time writing AI code and making endless test maps to make sure the AI do cool stuff.

I don't want to blow my own trumpet but I do recommend you check out the AI in my MOD In The Shadows. The AI can path around the maps, hunt down the player in packs, operate buttons, open routes and even jump off ledges they are stuck on initially. Playing against AI that look like they know what they are doing is big thing for me but don't underestimate the effort it will take to get the AI to path around obstacles and move around a simple split level room.

I assume your AI node-tree system is embedded in the map. Is it possible to use external files like .ents to define where certain trigger/nodes are? I was thinking about the whole AI logic mechanics the other day after playing your mod. Hmm maybe even an ai node editor in the engine ;P

[QuakeRoot]

I don't want to blow my own trumpet but I do recommend you check out the AI in my MOD In The Shadows. The AI can path around the maps, hunt down the player in packs, operate buttons, open routes and even jump off ledges they are stuck on initially. Playing against AI that look like they know what they are doing is big thing for me but don't underestimate the effort it will take to get the AI to path around obstacles and move around a simple split level room.

Intelligent AI is important for me too, I'll try your mod today Sock, I'm a big fan of the Thief games, I've always liked the sneaky "you have to think about this" gameplay. I've been wanting to play your mod for some time, this is a great reason!

Umm there are technical and game design reasons for AI moving slower. If monsters move too fast they having problems turning (will need different speeds and better AI code), moving up and down steps (movetogoal code) too fast is not possible because of very restrictive bounding boxes and finally fast AI can be really hard to track for new players.

In that case, perhaps not make them faster but smarter, and have MORE of them. It always bothered me that the Rots are only in one episode. They're not even on each level of the episode.

Ah well... the benefit of this project is we can make many of the changes the original developers didn't have time for.