RiftQuake

[Dutch]

Went back and gave the talon a more industrial, rugged look while maintaining the same materials. Ditched the camo entirely. One of the things I don't like about modern games is how flashy or complex the firearms look. I wanted to keep it simple. For example, look at Quake 4's shotgun. IMO, it has too much detail. Compare it to a Remington Model 870, which is very common in both military and hunting.

Quake 4: Too many unnecessary details


Remington 870: economical and reliable


Finally, here's the talon for Rift. Kept it simple with a short-barrel design, and ditched all the goofy colors. Note that there is no light acting on the model, so it looks a little more plain than it would in-game.




Obviously I fell prey to the "add as much flashy detail as you can" syndrome. But I think this is more along the lines of what it should be.

EDIT: One thing I'd like to look into is bump mapping. This model wouldn't benefit much from it (there aren't multiple textures in the same plane), but the rifle might, which is up next.

EDIT: Another random mention on the Q4 shotgun...the profile reminds me of a Kalishnikov. I hate those rifles. Lol.

[Dutch]

@Nickelbawker

Just saw your post. Damn those weapons are worn. I think a little bit of battle-scarring on the shotgun is actually a good idea. The only concern is it always bugged me that every shotgun you pick up in-game, has the exact same battle scars. I suppose I could make a few different skins with scarring and randomly generate them in-game. Good call, gonna play with this now. And right on man, Aliens is my favorite sci-fi film. I've never played crysis but I can tell you there's no way I can match that graphical quality without spending 5 years on this project lol I'm a full time metal fabricator, not a 3d modeler lol. If I can get halo 2 quality or maybe a cut above that, I'll be happy.

EDIT: Hey I just saw your comment on the youtube channel, thanks man!

[Nickelbawker]

My comment about crysis was directed at Seven's earlier comment and I think his was in reply to some one else. Should have put that. It's also meant to just state my opinion, no facts.

I like the black shotgun better but I think it could use a normal(bump) map and a gloss(spec) map.

[Dutch]

My comment about crysis was directed at Seven's earlier comment and I think his was in reply to some one else. Should have put that. It's also meant to just state my opinion, no facts.

Oh I know. I didn't mean to sound defensive or anything. I'm going to play with some other maps, see what happens. Once it's in the game, there's some other things I can do to make it glossy and what not using engine extensions. This is a total science, there is so much a person can do to fine-tune a single texture. It's pretty intriguing stuff.

[MadGypsy]

There ya go - now you need to add some luma maps. Once you get a little shine on the weapon, the details will really pop. You might want to lighten up your texture a bit, too. I know there is no light source but, it's still too dark.

A trick I like to use is to open up the reference image in a program that has an eye-dropper tool. You can then use that tool to "steal" the real colors right off of the image. This may seem rudimentary (and it is) but watch how "not dark" the color swatches you choose will end up being.

Those dark gun colors (on real guns) are contrasted by other stuff (shines and shadows) so they seem much darker than they really are. Make your gun 3-5% brighter and add some richness to any color that becomes washed out.

Let's be honest, you wouldn't drop into combat with such a flashy piece of weaponry.

But I bet you could kill the hell out of a little birdie with it.


Dude! That should be your mod - GUILT:The Shooting Game. Basically you run around with a gun and try to scare animals with it but, no matter what, your bullet always ends up killing whatever you were trying to scare. The game ends with a printout on the screen.

Hey Loser Boy,
you just killed 72 animals for no apparent reason. Jesus hates you.

[Dutch]

@gypsy: I took your advice and it sure made a huge difference. Throwing in a specular map really made the textures stand out. Thanks buddy.

After hours of messing with the shotgun, I had to make a few geometry changes that weren't sitting well with me. Additionally, since I began texturing, I have brushed up some skills after following some tutorials and messing with Gimp myself. I'm chalking up the first texture to gained experience. I'm currently re-doing it with a better workflow. The palette will be similar though.

Right now, I'm layering a specular --> bump --> AO --> normal. Pictures tomorrow hopefully.

I have a quick question for anyone who might know, not so much related to texturing. I've been doing some research on the benefits/drawbacks of different model types supported by the advanced engines. Either I'm just not searching in the right parts of the internet, or no one has a real definitive answer (mostly pertaining to model file limits such as texture resolution and triangle count). Between MD3, DarkPlaces DPM, and Wavefront OBJ, what model would best suit my needs?

The go-to for everyone seems to be Q3's MD3 format, since it can be split into different sub-groups to allow more than the 8000 or so triangle limit. I'll never trip this for the weapons, but more complex models such as large monsters etc. may push it. I also understand it has a 1024 Quake Unit size limitation in xyz directions (probly not a real concern).

I can't seem to track down these specs for DPM or OBJ formats. Can anyone steer me in the right direction? OBJ doesn't seem to be a favorite amongst Quake modders as far as I can tell.

Thanks.

[Spike]

The DPM format is shite. Don't bother with it.
OBJ is recognised by q3map2 if you're making q3bsp static mesh stuff. Its not useful as an animated thing.
MD3 is flawed for any organic things like player models, where it can be just as goofy as MDL.

Basically, use IQM for everything that doesn't involve q3map2. So long as your tools don't crap out on you.

[MadGypsy]

Spike already said it but, I was gonna say it before I got to his post. In order that I'm not a complete parrot, I provided you a link for the tools too.

IQM (inter-quake model)

[Seven]

Hello Dutch,

Seeing that you are excited about the "effect textures" which are supported by DP & FTE, there are a lot of existing "effect textures" for world textures, models and skins that make use / include these kind of textures.
You could test them in order to see what can be done with these, and how things look without them.
The readme page of Darkplaces homepage for example, lists all supported "effect texture" types (if you didnt saw it yet), such as _norm, _bump, _gloss, _glow, _luma.
A really nice effect can be achieved with the _glow "effect texture", which keeps visible in dark areas and almost not visible in bright areas.

Combined with a small gun animation, you can get some nice effects with it, for example:
Download
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5HkfGYFAXI]Quake-interactive-weapon-skins-final.avi - YouTube[/ame]
If Spike or LH would introduce self.weaponskin support (which quite a few modders has been ask for, hehe), things like these would be a lot easier to achieve
(and I do not mean csqc here)



In addition to the regular "effect textures" you can also add shaders to your textures, and let the real fun begin
FTE support the Q3:A shaders, while DP supports only some of them. DP supports only a single pass + lightmap shader, which might be enough for you.
DP also introduces dp-specific shaders, which are described inside the "darkplaces.txt" file for example which comes with every DP build at the very end (also the DP-wiki has a lot of infos).
With these you can get quite interesting additional effects. You maybe already saw the "DP Pretty Water" packs and variations of it for other Quake liquids.
You can add those to world and model textures as well.
Here is one example of dpreflectcube:
Download
Considering, you are using modern weapons in your game (with a lot of metal), this effect maybe fit ?
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DA5CXg-wJM0]stupid barrel idea - YouTube[/ame]


You will find a lot of other examples in webangel�s mod here.


Be careful , when you want to go down that path though, as DP and FTE will most probably not support them equally. As mentioned, these engines have some own shader features, while others (Q3:A) are not fully supported by DP.
So, if you want to make your game compatible for both engines, you will have to either make 2 packs or pay close attention which features you are using.


Regarding your model format question:
You say that you didn’t find anything useful in the internet. Did you search at inside3d (yes, that forum again ) ?
It has its own model subforum and you will find people asking the same question there a couple of times (also in other subforums)
Example this thread here, which gives you some pros and cons.
A quick google search for "iqm quake" will give you access to all you need.

Best of luck,
Seven

[gnounc]

*squawk* use iqm *squawk*

[Dutch]

Awesome, thanks guys, that is good to know and IQM is the quick and definitive answer I was looking for.

@seven: Those are some awesome effects and I can't wait to start experimenting with the different shader and effect features, thanks for the vids! Also thanks for the link on iqm. I have seen that thread before, I guess I was too bent on finding different limitation values between the models to consider other factors. This is more new territory, the only model I'm familiar with is MDL, and as gypsy once said, it's like the oldest model on the planet. Lol.

I now have a fully textured shotgun I'm pretty happy with. This weekend, if I have time, I'm going to start animating/exporting/compiling/etc. and see if I can't get it functioning in-game for some basic weaponframes.

[MadGypsy]

I wonder what model format I am in. I mean, supposedly humans evolve, so with each evolution a new "model format" is created (or maybe you could say the old one is upgraded - that's still a new format though). Hundreds of years ago, you were old if you lived to 30 and it would seem that even the common cold could kill you. Now we can consume processed poisons for our entire life and live to be (a very miserable) 80 so, obviously my "model format" is not the same as the one being used hundreds of years ago.

I have so many questions before I die and go to hell. I wonder if God will let me spend eternity asking them.

[Dutch]

I wonder what model format I am in

Lmao I'm probly sitting around an MD2 if don't stop injuring myself at the gym.

Ok I made a quick texture for the .300 BLK stinger. I really wanted to include some camo on this firearm, as well as the Magpul-ish synthetic buttstock and a chromed barrel/bolt/forward laser. I need this put in perspective from someone else's eyes before I fine-tune the texture with bumping and spec maps. Is it too flashy? What can be improved? Should the tan accessories be a shade or two darker? Is the camo too much? Thanks guys.

[talisa]

eyup, its exactly as you said yourself....
the camo is a bit on the bright side, and the tan would look nicer if it wasnt so bright imo

try making the camo a bit less bright, and perhaps add a texture-filter over it so that it doesnt look so plain and cartoony. like something like the filter on this

right now its to plain and clean and flat-colored, which makes it look fake

[gnounc]

you need to bevel and angle the gun. the pump looks crazy boxy, and so does the inside ring of the stock, and the outside edges of the stock.

Here you can see that everything on the m41a alien pulse rifle is either angled, or curved so that it doesnt look like a box.



I would use matte colors with baked in AO to showcase the models. The textures you're using cover more detail up than they make stand out. Using matte textures with baked AO will let you see more clearly where you should add detail.